Combat difficulty?

[Nynuc]

Hey guys, I remeber the combat being alot harder for some reason for each individual zombie. Now it seems every swing will either knock a zombie down, Or kill them. It also appears the 'Charging up' system has been removed.

 

Is there a way to switch back to this? I really miss it, It was hard and intense, Combat now seems really simple, and zombies to me seem like nothing once I get a bat or a frying pan. I really like the new stomping and such, But I do miss the challenge of fighting multiple zombies, And I really do hope there's an option to switch back to it.

 

Thanks

[miyamura]

Start a new game, on sandbox mode with ultra zombies (all setup to max) with an "insane" population of zombies and you'll see how the first zombie you'll see will eat your guts.Also I feel like the charging up is still there. Whenever I don't "charge up" zombies just won't go down... But I can be wrong, that's just how I feel.

[GoldenBullet]

Well the charging system is still in game. Zombies in general just kinda suck they really only have two things going for them

- Numbers

- Infection

 

In general if your looking for more of a challenge i would suggest playing in Sandbox mode against sprinters and superhuman strength. As well as just playing on the westpoint map since theres more zombies in general.

[FawkesGaming]

Start a new game, on survival mode with ultra zombies (all setup to max) with an "insane" population of zombies and you'll see how the first zombie you'll see will eat your guts.Also I feel like the charging up is still there. Whenever I don't "charge up" zombies just won't go down... But I can be wrong, that's just how I feel.

I feel this way as well, it seems unless I hold Cntrl and RMB my shots are ineffective.

[Burianu]

I feel like what this game really needs right about now is a revamped fatigue system.  The addition of more long-term fatigue would serve as a disincentive for any form of melee combat, unless absolutely necessary, to save energy.  It would also make guns a more attractive combat option, which is also a good thing because I remember hearing something about base character aim being reduced soon.

[Garbonzo]

Hey guys, I remeber the combat being alot harder for some reason for each individual zombie. Now it seems every swing will either knock a zombie down, Or kill them. It also appears the 'Charging up' system has been removed.

 

Is there a way to switch back to this? I really miss it, It was hard and intense, Combat now seems really simple, and zombies to me seem like nothing once I get a bat or a frying pan. I really like the new stomping and such, But I do miss the challenge of fighting multiple zombies, And I really do hope there's an option to switch back to it.

 

Thanks

The casual gamer hated it and complained about it in the old forum, thus it was removed. 

 

I prefer the old combat where you had charge your attack and aim for the head with your curser to get a killing blow. Game is still just to easy. The main reason to see just how easy it has become is to just look at how MP servers need "resetting" of zombie population because they are all easily killed

[Burianu]

 

Hey guys, I remeber the combat being alot harder for some reason for each individual zombie. Now it seems every swing will either knock a zombie down, Or kill them. It also appears the 'Charging up' system has been removed.

 

Is there a way to switch back to this? I really miss it, It was hard and intense, Combat now seems really simple, and zombies to me seem like nothing once I get a bat or a frying pan. I really like the new stomping and such, But I do miss the challenge of fighting multiple zombies, And I really do hope there's an option to switch back to it.

 

Thanks

The casual gamer hated it and complained about it in the old forum, thus it was removed. 

 

I prefer the old combat where you had charge your attack and aim for the head with your curser to get a killing blow. Game is still just to easy. The main reason to see just how easy it has become is to just look at how MP servers need "resetting" of zombie population because they are all easily killed

 

 

I feel like long-term fatigue would help with this at least a little, though more might have to be done to prevent this in MP.  Battling with zombies should weaken you for a period of time until you rest and recuperate, if you're out on the town, sprinting around hauling loot and battling zombies, you're certainly going to have a hard time AT LEAST the next day, perhaps longer, and you will want to take it easy and rest those days.  This is intuitive and would only require a moodle indicating why the character is weaker.

[unsaved_progress]

 

Start a new game, on survival mode with ultra zombies (all setup to max) with an "insane" population of zombies and you'll see how the first zombie you'll see will eat your guts.Also I feel like the charging up is still there. Whenever I don't "charge up" zombies just won't go down... But I can be wrong, that's just how I feel.

I feel this way as well, it seems unless I hold Cntrl and RMB my shots are ineffective.

 

 

left CTRL and RMB do the same thing Fawkes.

 

and i'm pretty sure the charging system is still in the game, I'm only new but I've always had to charge up before whacking otherwise, yeah, they don't go down. not sure if there used to be a charge gauge though which is now (at least visually) missing...

[EnigmaGrey]

The only alteration to the attack system since June is really the ability to push zombies. Charging, and all of that is still present, and you'll find varying results as you play.

The only thing that isn't in, that was present in 2.0r 2.5, is the ability to do head shots explicitly.

[ApolloDiaspora]

The only alteration to the attack system since June is really the ability to push zombies. Charging, and all of that is still present, and you'll find varying results as you play.

The only thing that isn't in, that was present in 2.0r 2.5, is the ability to do head shots explicitly.

 

That being said, it appears that your character aims for the head by default. In multiplayer, we had a player die from a close encounter with an axe. Severe shoulder and head damage. Same thing happened when I got in the way of a discharging shotgun. All the damage was confined to the head and shoulder sections, which causes bleedout very, very quickly.

 

As far as Zombies being too easy to knockdown and kill... I'd say you've just been lucky. Had some pretty intense moments in singleplayer of late, where I was forced to barely charge attacks, or chargeswing when fatigued. Zeds simply don't get knocked over when you do that.

[Suomiboi]

The only thing that isn't in, that was present in 2.0r 2.5, is the ability to do head shots explicitly.

I'd love to have this back in game. At least as a hardcore mode like the reloading.

[ZedHead]

What ever happened to this sort of combat in PZ?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xu-Jendxy4

 

Zombies posed as a darn threat to me in the old builds and nearly bit me every time I tried to defend or attack, although that was simply the lack of a proper aiming system in 1.5d . Even so, my point still stands and I'm kinda put off by PZ's current combat and how easy it is to kill hundreds or even thousands of zombies without a problem. I really hope TIS plans to re-implement a system such as the one shown above and revamp the melee combat some how (which I'm sure they have planned since it has changed a lot over time).

[EnigmaGrey]

It got morphed into a "hold right mouse button to charge" system.

But I do agree -- the combat seems to be getting easier than harder (partially, it's a matter of perspective, the more we play it, the better we are, while others struggles).

A rather odd thing I found out just recently is that I can't seem to "push" zombies down if I have a weapon. Suddenly, having a weapon is almost a liability, compared to the ease at which you can just shove a zombie on the ground and stomp it empty handed -- enough so that you can whittle down a horde without any need of a weapon.

[unsaved_progress]

Yeah, I've pushed Zeke down with a bat in my hand. it mostly happens when I'm cornered with 2-3 swarming me and I haven't got had the time to charge so I just click frantically (obviously not standard practice but this is an emergency!) 

 

In the case of not being charged up, you tend to only have the strength to push them over (and I do mean pushing them over with your hands extended not knocking them down with your weapon), or at least that's my experience. 

 

EDIT: Also, what I wanted to say about the combat difficulty is that I don't mind that one on one Zeke is easy to take down, they shouldn't be much of a problem. The whole thing about zombies (for me) is that one is slow, rotting and not a big concern, its their numbers and their relentless pursuit that makes them formidable. So yeah, one on one combat could be a bit tougher (I actually quite liked that reticule system, as a Steamboy I hadn't seen that before) but I personally like the way it balances lore/fiction/mythology and gameplay. 

[TheVastator]

The whole thing about zombies (for me) is that one is slow, rotting and not a big concern, its their numbers and their relentless pursuit that makes them formidable.

this.

Facing a lone zombie isn't and shouldn't be a problem. The problems start when you face two, three or more at once...as it should be, in my opinion

 

Have you tried some sandbox with Insane quantity of zombies? Even if you make them weak, short sighted and half dumb, if you aren't cautious you get swarmed easily.

[ApolloDiaspora]

I think unarmed melee combat is kinda balanced the way it is now. Sure, you can easily push them down, but actually KILLING a zombie takes a lot of stomping. Drops the number of zombies you can reliably kill at once to one or two, simply because it takes so long to kill a zed once you push it down.

 

I DO think the spoons, forks, pens and pencils need a major buff though. Yeah, their durability is crap, but without the under-the-chin-into-the-brain swing you get with the butterknife, you're left with half-assedly stabbing a zombie in the forehead, and as they don't knock a zombie back, those (maybe) two hits you get in before the weapon breaks tend to do bugger all. Going without something sharp and simply pushing them down is a better option all round. Hell, being able to do an unarmed shove, then wailing on them with a pen while they're on the ground could be the better option, rather than a damage buff.

 

As for the zombies in general being easy to kill... I dunno. I'm running Build 25 at the moment, and I seem to be running into more 'fresh' zombies of late. That is, they're fast, can see you an entire screen length away (with their back to you, while sneaking), and seem really, really sensitive to noise. It might just be bad luck on my part (ironic given I grabbed the Lucky trait), but it seems that swinging a bat into a zombie, let along caving in it's skull, seems to pull all the zombies on the screen to your position. Some of my most intense moments in my current game have come from facing 4-5 zombies at once, with a couple being fast. You can't get them to the floor quick enough, nor finish them off when they're down there.

[Nynuc]

I wish their would at least be an option to switch back to the old combat. I really really enjoyed it, And the removal of it was really dissapointing for me. I don't believe it's something that's still intigrated now, If there is a charge and fatigue effect still in place it's something I haven't noticed.

 

Turning the zombies up harder or to sprinters I don't think will help much. It really just drains the fun and replayability when I'm knocking zombies over with no timing or effort whatsoever. I no longer fear combat or travel if I'm carrying a bat or golf club because the combat to me has become so boring and repetitive because it usually plays out the same way every time. and that's Knock over the zombie with the first hit or two, Then proceed to bash his brains in.

I believe the old system required alot more thought about movement and positioning, Also fatigue.

What ever happened to this sort of combat in PZ?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xu-Jendxy4

 

Zombies posed as a darn threat to me in the old builds and nearly bit me every time I tried to defend or attack, although that was simply the lack of a proper aiming system in 1.5d . Even so, my point still stands and I'm kinda put off by PZ's current combat and how easy it is to kill hundreds or even thousands of zombies without a problem. I really hope TIS plans to re-implement a system such as the one shown above and revamp the melee combat some how (which I'm sure they have planned since it has changed a lot over time).

Also, This is great as well. What happened to this system?

[Tsambo]

What ever happened to this sort of combat in PZ?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xu-Jendxy4

 

Zombies posed as a darn threat to me in the old builds and nearly bit me every time I tried to defend or attack, although that was simply the lack of a proper aiming system in 1.5d . Even so, my point still stands and I'm kinda put off by PZ's current combat and how easy it is to kill hundreds or even thousands of zombies without a problem. I really hope TIS plans to re-implement a system such as the one shown above and revamp the melee combat some how (which I'm sure they have planned since it has changed a lot over time).

Wow, great system. What if i want to just shoot another survivor to the legs? I really think you should be able to aim your gun, like above.

[CaptKaspar]

What ever happened to this sort of combat in PZ?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xu-Jendxy4

 

Zombies posed as a darn threat to me in the old builds and nearly bit me every time I tried to defend or attack, although that was simply the lack of a proper aiming system in 1.5d . Even so, my point still stands and I'm kinda put off by PZ's current combat and how easy it is to kill hundreds or even thousands of zombies without a problem. I really hope TIS plans to re-implement a system such as the one shown above and revamp the melee combat some how (which I'm sure they have planned since it has changed a lot over time).

 

Wow, this system featured here looks really cool! Where did it go?!?

[EnigmaGrey]

The old system was "spam left click to kill everything." The screenshot above only came to being in the first few 2.0 builds, and only affected pistols, as far as I'm aware.

[ZedHead]

The old system was "spam left click to kill everything." The screenshot above only came to being in the first few 2.0 builds, and only affected pistols, as far as I'm aware.

 

Very true, the first mechanics for the pistol was that shown above and was early footage of the game that never really took place (unless you're one of those special people) sadly. I'm hoping TIS brings it back for all firearms and perhaps something to follow up on melee combat as well. 

[EnigmaGrey]

But the only difference between it and the current system is the shrinking aiming reticule.



(Ignoring the need to click on the head -- that feature I do miss.)

[Nynuc]

But the only difference between it and the current system is the shrinking aiming reticule.

(Ignoring the need to click on the head -- that feature I do miss.)

Guns I'm not too worried about, I just want the old melee system.

[Tsambo]

But the only difference between it and the current system is the shrinking aiming reticule.

(Ignoring the need to click on the head -- that feature I do miss.)

Well as someone who fell in love with that old system you are talking about with the shrinking aiming circle, what do you mean? If i aimed to someone's feet with that old lovely system wouldn't i shoot his/her feet? It's really neat to be able to make that choice, or just shoot near him/her as a warning shot.

 

My general opinion on that shrinking aiming circle is that it combines survivor firearm skill, survivor's mental and physical state, current weapon's durability and weapon's effective range all in one lovely feature. The shrinking aiming circle. I just loved it (did i mention that allready?)!!!

 

Last but not least it's really satisfying to use your own personal skill as a player at clicking and shooting to shoot heads off. Like a good old FPS, which all of us have enjoyed at some point of our gaming careers i suppose.

 

So to sum up it's a feature reasonably realistic and simple and it just looks tons of fun to use.

 

I really hope they are considering bringing it back.

 

PS: Let me share a little secret with you. I was thinking of making a thread about that old aiming system over at Suggestions, to be sure someone would consider it and to see people's reactions. What do you think mister EnigmaGrey?

[EnigmaGrey]

If you guys have a Desura account, you might want to look up one of the old versions and see just how combat was: http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/2064-older-versions/?hl=%2Bdownload+%2Bversions#entry29858

i.e: spam left click (like Diablo) to just blitz through everything, before the charging system.

And no, the aiming circle only affected your chance to hit -- if you tried aiming at feet, or something, the game wouldn't know.