House alarms are the most immersion-breaking thing

[reasonpolice]

As the game stands right now, security alarms are the one and only feature of PZ that ruins my experience. This one little big thing makes the game pretty much unplayable for me. 

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

Why does the alarm wait to trigger until you're inside instead of immediately when you shatter the window? Many home security systems have glass-break/window sensors; they should trigger as soon as the glass so much as cracks.

As for the blaring sirens... I'm pretty sure 99% of home security systems don't have those. All of the examples I've seen (not too many, I admit) have a silent activation, letting the security company know that a break-in has occurred. The company then calls the home/homeowner to ensure it wasn't just user error, and calls police dispatch in the event of an emergency. 

 

Also, I'm HIGHLY doubtful that any of the residents in some small town in Tennessee have any sort of home security beyond the family dog or a shotgun hanging on the wall.

 

On top of that, after living in a little town in Kansas (Population ~2900) for two years, I would say that crime is pretty much non-existent in areas like that. People barely even lock their doors. There isn't even a need for home security.

 

So, all in all, pretty much no aspect of these 'house alarms' makes any sense whatsoever. Zilch. Nada. No disrespect to The Indie Stone at all, but it seems like just some cheap little gimmick or afterthought to add a random element of artificial difficulty to the game. 

Given the current fantastic zombie spawning and migration system, I'd say the game is hard enough without the alarms. To me it makes sense to completely remove them from the game.

TL;DR: House alarms make no sense at all, take them out of the game.

 

 

P.S. I totally still play this game and love it despite saying it's unplayable :<

[Rathlord]

Heya OldWorld,

 

You can disable the alarms in sandbox mode if you don't happen to like them. I haven't found that much of a problem with them personally, and quite like the challenge.

 

You can see the crime rates in Muldraugh here: http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Muldraugh-Kentucky.html and there certainly is plenty.

 

I actually work in the construction industry in a small town. Security systems are quite popular as a standard option, especially in mid to high end homes. They probably don't need to be prevalent in trailer parks, but there's definitely very realistic basis for them being in homes aside from the gameplay value.

 

Cya round.

[EnigmaGrey]

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

They should, however alarms do seem to reset until the player enters.

 

Why does the alarm wait to trigger until you're inside instead of immediately when you shatter the window? Many home security systems have glass-break/window sensors; they should trigger as soon as the glass so much as cracks.

Good idea, though it sort of ruins the suspense a bit. Personally, I like people being caught inside. If you look in the game files, there's also a count down sound effect and voiced warning.*

 

As for the blaring sirens... I'm pretty sure 99% of home security systems don't have those. All of the examples I've seen (not too many, I admit) have a silent activation, letting the security company know that a break-in has occurred. The company then calls the home/homeowner to ensure it wasn't just user error, and calls police dispatch in the event of an emergency.

ADT, the most popular alarm company in North America, loves blaring sirens.

 

Also, I'm HIGHLY doubtful that any of the residents in some small town in Tennessee have any sort of home security beyond the family dog or a shotgun hanging on the wall.

If they're plentiful in Ecum Secum, Nova Scotia, I'd assume they're popular in most rural settings, particularly since most insurance companies will provide a rebate.

 

So, all in all, pretty much no aspect of these 'house alarms' makes any sense whatsoever. Zilch. Nada. No disrespect to The Indie Stone at all, but it seems like just some cheap little gimmick or afterthought to add a random element of artificial difficulty to the game. 

Given the current fantastic zombie spawning and migration system, I'd say the game is hard enough without the alarms. To me it makes sense to completely remove them from the game.

TL;DR: House alarms make no sense at all, take them out of the game.

 

 

P.S. I totally still play this game and love it despite saying it's unplayable :<

Sure dropped the ball on the "no disrespect" thing. Sorry they've offended you so much, but demanding something be removed (or added!) to the game isn't appropriate.

*Like most things in the game, everything is in a constant state of flux. Just because it's simplistic now doesn't necessarily mean it'll be simplistic in the future, or that the developers don't have some ideas for how to improve the systems. Everyone's time is limited.

[LeoIvanov]

I would also like to point out that the game is set in the past, and not present times, so the advanced and improved technology regarding house alarms still haven't arrived at the game's timeline.

[Demonic_Kat]

I don't mind the alarms so much, but the distance that they can be heard is kinda odd. No matter where players are at on my server, if I trip an alarm they can hear it.

[Rathlord]

I don't mind the alarms so much, but the distance that they can be heard is kinda odd. No matter where players are at on my server, if I trip an alarm they can hear it.

 

That could probably use a bug report, if it doesn't have one now!

[reasonpolice]

 

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

They should, however alarms do seem to reset until the player enters.

 

Why does the alarm wait to trigger until you're inside instead of immediately when you shatter the window? Many home security systems have glass-break/window sensors; they should trigger as soon as the glass so much as cracks.

Good idea, though it sort of ruins the suspense a bit. Personally, I like people being caught inside. If you look in the game files, there's also a count down sound effect and voiced warning.*

 

As for the blaring sirens... I'm pretty sure 99% of home security systems don't have those. All of the examples I've seen (not too many, I admit) have a silent activation, letting the security company know that a break-in has occurred. The company then calls the home/homeowner to ensure it wasn't just user error, and calls police dispatch in the event of an emergency.

ADT, the most popular alarm company in North America, loves blaring sirens.

 

Also, I'm HIGHLY doubtful that any of the residents in some small town in Tennessee have any sort of home security beyond the family dog or a shotgun hanging on the wall.

If they're plentiful in Ecum Secum, Nova Scotia, I'd assume they're popular in most rural settings, particularly since most insurance companies will provide a rebate.

 

So, all in all, pretty much no aspect of these 'house alarms' makes any sense whatsoever. Zilch. Nada. No disrespect to The Indie Stone at all, but it seems like just some cheap little gimmick or afterthought to add a random element of artificial difficulty to the game. 

Given the current fantastic zombie spawning and migration system, I'd say the game is hard enough without the alarms. To me it makes sense to completely remove them from the game.

TL;DR: House alarms make no sense at all, take them out of the game.

 

 

P.S. I totally still play this game and love it despite saying it's unplayable :<

Sure dropped the ball on the "no disrespect" thing. Sorry they've offended you so much, but demanding something be removed (or added!) to the game isn't appropriate.

*Like most things in the game, everything is in a constant state of flux. Just because it's simplistic now doesn't necessarily mean it'll be simplistic in the future, or that the developers don't have some ideas for how to improve the systems. Everyone's time is limited.

 

I didn't really demand anything... I stated my opinion as an opinion, not a demand or a fact... I love TIS and what they've done with this game. It's not that the alarms are really challenging, either, they just don't make much sense to me. I guess it's all the tiny little one-bed one-bath houses with alarms that bugs me, it'd make more sense for them to trigger more often on the bigger houses.

[Asrayl]

It is actually uncommon for most residential alarm systems to remain silent. The presence of a loud siren ensures that any residents currently occupying the structure are aware of the situation, and serves as an active deterrent to any would-be home intruders. Business alarms tend towards the silent alerts, since they have to try and mitigate the risks of armed intruders, in regards to maintaining a safe environment for their clients. If they startle a would-be robber and that person opens fire, it places them in a surprisingly actionable position, legally. 

 

I would like to see differentiation between homes and businesses for the purposes of alarms, but beyond that, the system seems fine as-is. 

[CaptKaspar]

 

 

Also, I'm HIGHLY doubtful that any of the residents in some small town in Tennessee have any sort of home security beyond the family dog or a shotgun hanging on the wall.

 

Really? What makes you that doubtful? Or do you have any supporting reason, or is it just a stereotypical view that you have? Do you have family there, travel there for work, take vacations there, or maybe an old friend you keep in touch with?

 

Also the game takes place in Kentucky, but I suppose that's not a very important point because they are all the same anyways, right?

 

As for your opinion of the house alarms:

 

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

 

Most alarm companies use as their basic motion detection; Passive Infrared Sensors. Without getting into the science much (here if anyone needs info) they use body heat to detect human movement that would trigger the alarm.

 

Are zombies warm enough to trigger an alarm activation? I suppose this is debatable in the lore of zombies. I for one think of them as dead, and therefore are likely cold. The lore of the zombies in PZ has not been explained (biological virus, voodoo, angry god, celestial alignment, necromancy, or dragons all could have caused the Z-Apoc) so this is how I get past the zombies not setting off alarms. They are dead and cold and therefore do not set off the motion detectors since the motion detectors do not see them.

 

 

Why does the alarm wait to trigger until you're inside instead of immediately when you shatter the window? Many home security systems have glass-break/window sensors; they should trigger as soon as the glass so much as cracks.

 

 

I agree that the alarm should activate when a window is broken (assuming there is the vibration sensor is on the window, and I think that's a fair assumption).

 

However, if a window is not broken and you enter through an unlocked door while the alarm is active, you have a period of time to enter your pass code before either the silent alarm or the very loud audible alarm is set off. At least that is how my home's ADT system works. If it didn't work this way, you would have your alarm go off every time you enter your home when the alarm is active. This explains the delay before the alarm is activated once you are inside.

 

 

On top of that, after living in a little town in Kansas (Population ~2900) for two years, I would say that crime is pretty much non-existent in areas like that. People barely even lock their doors. There isn't even a need for home security.

 

 

I lived for 20 years in a small rural farming town, I admit not in Kentucky, that only had one stop light (well 2 if you counted the yellow flashing one at the school entrance) and my home was robbed. So, nodisrepect, but I disagree based on my experiences. The shotgun on the wall is of little value when you are out with the family dog and not at home.

 

Sorry reasonpolice, but I am putting you under citizen's reason arrest. You have the right to remain to silent...

[Demonic_Kat]

 

I don't mind the alarms so much, but the distance that they can be heard is kinda odd. No matter where players are at on my server, if I trip an alarm they can hear it.

 

That could probably use a bug report, if it doesn't have one now!

 

yessir

I didn't realize it was a bug.

[reasonpolice]

I now realize residential alarms and business alarms are different, my mistake. 

 

 

 

Sorry reasonpolice, but I am putting you under citizen's reason arrest. You have the right to remain to silent...

 

 

Har har I c wut u did ther.  I definitely meant Kentucky, not Tennessee, that was like a brain typo. I actually do have family living in Tennessee so that's what my brain decided to type. Said family always like to talk about how easygoing small town life is, and how they "don't even lock [their] doors!" Having visited them, and also having lived in Kansas, I guess I actually have formed the notion that most rural areas in Bread Basket, U.S.A. are pretty similar. I suppose that's wrong, sorry you got robbed.

Also, very good point on the thermal sensors, I hadn't even considered that.

Haha man I dun goofed with this thread. Oh well. 

[Asrayl]

 

 

 

Most alarm companies use as their basic motion detection; Passive Infrared Sensors. Without getting into the science much (here if anyone needs info) they use body heat to detect human movement that would trigger the alarm.

 

 

 

Actually, a good home security installation involves (generally) three different kinds of sensors, and a good business security involves one additional sensor. 

 

The first is a magnetic contact switch, it triggers when a door or window is opened, two magnetic plates move away from each other and that contact is broken. 

 

The second is a motion sensor, these, as you mentioned are often PIR sensors, which rely on body heat, or dual type which include microwave usage in a reflective distance capacity (wherein a sudden change in the environs causes the microwaves to bounce back at different intervals, triggering an alarm) These require both sensors to trip before signalling an alert. 

 

The third is acoustic. There are two main acoustic types I'll speak of here. One is used to detect the high frequency sound of breaking glass, and is kept near windows to respond to that kind of intrusion. The other is area reflective or ultrasonic frequency which bounces IR waves or ultrasonic sound, responding to sudden changes in the reflection time of the light/sound waves. 

 

A good home security system, the kind you'd get from a reputable company, would never recommend only one kind of sensor. 

[Asrayl]

Edited to add; I'd neglected to mention the additional alarm feature businesses tend to have.RF/ RFID radio receivers. These go off when an RFID tag on merchandise hasn't been appropriately de-activated and that tag passes through the sensor gates. 

 

Would be -really- neat to see looted goods from stores sometimes set off alarms... or have actual gates put in to make us have to plan our entrance/exit route. The mall would be an absolute nightmare if the power was still on.

 

... edited to add; this did not go through as an edit. Because I'm dumb.

[syfy]

sure, in a MODERN security system.

 

PZ is not set in modern times, i believe it is set around the 90's? or so (we were just talking about this less than 2 weeks ago)

 

 

but either way, some stuff cannot be true to life in the name of game play. some liberties have to be taken.

 

 

don't worry so much about it, there is nothing you can do about it anyway

[Mike280]

To chime in here, my house that I grew up in the 90's had an alarm system.  Good ol' ADT.  Some things I learned about it::

 

1) They go off mostly because of your own incompetence (i.e. arming it at night, but forgetting to shunt the motion sensors.  If you needed to pee when you got up at night, you didn't need to use the toilet anymore after the alarm went off)

 

2)  Most the 90's ADT systems had EXTERNAL speakers/sirens installed on houses.  The salesman's logic for us to get that was that if someone was breaking in, you'd want to know, your neighbors would want to know, and people half a mile away really want to be woken up in the middle of the night (kidding on the last part, but you could hear it that far away)

 

3) Window break sensors, and window opening sensors for that matter are expensive, and really only a option on new construction (houses actively being built to the layman).  This was before WIFI, z-wave and Insteon (mostly), so wireless sensors didn't exist to the middle class.  So a break-in relied on the motion sensor catching the burglar entering the house. 

 

4) Depending on how the alarm was armed, there can be a delay in the alarm going off.  This is to allow the homeowner to disarm the alarm when entering the house.  The delay was anywhere from 5 to 15 seconds.  Motion sensors generally had zero delay.

 

I hope somebody finds this useful

[Rathlord]

House in my neighborhood in small town South Carolina had a sensor that just loved to go off in the middle of the night, about once every month or two. Would wake the entire neighborhood; thing was a real bastard.

 

 

There are retrofit window sensors prior to wireless, but since you had to bore a hole in the glass (which lets out any of the insulating gas your window might have and lowers in the insulation value) they voided every single window companies warranty, which was a big part of why you never saw them.

[AJ135]

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

 

I actually use this as a means to break into houses. I encourage a zombie to walk up to a window. When it happily starts bashing on it I either do the same to the next house or sit around for a bit. When I hear the glass smash I go to the window, give it a shout, kill the zed that walks out and hey presto the house is now alarm free. This also works for those pesky shops that always seem to be alarmed. Pretty sure this is a bug but even if it is fixed, the zombie would trip the alarm, not you, so it would still be a viable option.

[King jjwpenguin]

 

Why don't zombies trigger alarms? Any respectable home security system would involve basic motion detection; zombies should trigger them.

They should, however alarms do seem to reset until the player enters.

 

Why does the alarm wait to trigger until you're inside instead of immediately when you shatter the window? Many home security systems have glass-break/window sensors; they should trigger as soon as the glass so much as cracks.

Good idea, though it sort of ruins the suspense a bit. Personally, I like people being caught inside. If you look in the game files, there's also a count down sound effect and voiced warning.*

 

As for the blaring sirens... I'm pretty sure 99% of home security systems don't have those. All of the examples I've seen (not too many, I admit) have a silent activation, letting the security company know that a break-in has occurred. The company then calls the home/homeowner to ensure it wasn't just user error, and calls police dispatch in the event of an emergency.

ADT, the most popular alarm company in North America, loves blaring sirens.

 

Also, I'm HIGHLY doubtful that any of the residents in some small town in Tennessee have any sort of home security beyond the family dog or a shotgun hanging on the wall.

If they're plentiful in Ecum Secum, Nova Scotia, I'd assume they're popular in most rural settings, particularly since most insurance companies will provide a rebate.

 

So, all in all, pretty much no aspect of these 'house alarms' makes any sense whatsoever. Zilch. Nada. No disrespect to The Indie Stone at all, but it seems like just some cheap little gimmick or afterthought to add a random element of artificial difficulty to the game. 

Given the current fantastic zombie spawning and migration system, I'd say the game is hard enough without the alarms. To me it makes sense to completely remove them from the game.

TL;DR: House alarms make no sense at all, take them out of the game.

 

 

P.S. I totally still play this game and love it despite saying it's unplayable :<

Sure dropped the ball on the "no disrespect" thing. Sorry they've offended you so much, but demanding something be removed (or added!) to the game isn't appropriate.

*Like most things in the game, everything is in a constant state of flux. Just because it's simplistic now doesn't necessarily mean it'll be simplistic in the future, or that the developers don't have some ideas for how to improve the systems. Everyone's time is limited.

 

i agree with it all. cant find any flaw in your words.