The new Zombie System lacks dynamic.

[RedKrypton]

Currently the zombie density is not one bit dynamic. Zombies just stay in the starting density zones and never move outside of them. Just look at Eckyman in this video:

 

 

Ecky is over four months into his playthrough and the only thing changed is the zombie density, which is a lot higher. The distribution is about the same as the distribution of zombies during the first days of the game. Which should not be the case.

 

Because after at most a month zombie hordes or zombies in general should move out into the countryside, because food (people) is getting scarce in towns and cities. In short the zombie density should go from urban focused to a more and more uniform density over several years. Cities should even become safer than the countryside at some point (a few years) as almost all zombies moved out of it on their search for all living.

 

The real challenge after a few months should be other humans and gigantic hordes of thousands if not tens of thousands of zeds roaming around. General zombie density should become lower, but the horde size should become bigger and bigger.

[LeoIvanov]

To be perfectly fair, in Ecky's earlier videos he had done a great deal of effort to move a huge number of zombies away from his base by firing a shotgun repeatedly and moving away to the south-east towards the middle of the city, hence why there's a huge gap between the nearly empty surrounding area of the base, and actual city (where he lured all the zombies away into)..

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

[Livio Persemprio]

To be perfectly fair, in Ecky's earlier videos he had done a great deal of effort to move a huge number of zombies away from his base by firing a shotgun repeatedly and moving away to the south-east towards the middle of the city, hence why there's a huge gap between the nearly empty surrounding area of the base, and actual city (where he lured all the zombies away into)..

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

this, but without having empty cities, i think cities needs to be a dangerous area all the times for the gameplay

[RedKrypton]

this, but without having empty cities, i think cities needs to be a dangerous area all the times for the gameplay

 

 

Cities wouldn't be instantly safe. They would just empty and then there are still the loads of zombies in the city which are trapped inside buildings and then there will be the other scavengers competing with you. If they would lenghten the time crops need to be ripe for harvest and prohibit farming in winter there would be a much bigger incentive to also scavenge.

[MyTJ]

Have you tried tempering with Advanced sandbox settings for zombie population?

[MyTJ]

And if there are other scavenger in the cities, doesn't that qualify as zombie food?

[Livio Persemprio]

 

this, but without having empty cities, i think cities needs to be a dangerous area all the times for the gameplay

 

 

Cities wouldn't be instantly safe. They would just empty and then there are still the loads of zombies in the city which are trapped inside buildings and then there will be the other scavengers competing with you. If they would lenghten the time crops need to be ripe for harvest and prohibit farming in winter there would be a much bigger incentive to also scavenge.

 

indeed, but if we're talking about several months after the apocalypse, then this isn't something that the devs expect us to achieve as the majority of the community. i think that herd going around would be cool, but cities needs to be populated all the times, other survivors will take a lot of time to be programmed properly

[RedKrypton]

And if there are other scavenger in the cities, doesn't that qualify as zombie food?

They would return for supplies like you do. Think about it like the supply run Rick an the rest did in TWD season 1.

[RedKrypton]

indeed, but if we're talking about several months after the apocalypse, then this isn't something that the devs expect us to achieve as the majority of the community. i think that herd going around would be cool, but cities needs to be populated all the times, other survivors will take a lot of time to be programmed properly

 

 

 

That would just be the end result. In the meanwhile there could still be herds moving around.

[EnigmaGrey]

Already works this way on multplayer, due to multiple stimuli, compared to single player. Not sure how possible it is with such a small active area, but not against the idea.

[RedKrypton]

Already works this way on multplayer, due to multiple stimuli, compared to single player. Not sure how possible it is with such a small active area, but not against the idea.

Can't zombies already move if cells aren't loaded? Can't just hordes be moved as one entity, which loses and gains zombies on it's way.

[Jericoshost]

I always thought a good strategy would be to have each cell be given a random modifier to the population each time redistribution happens, and certain cells would have a bonus that is always given.

Like for each building/room inside a cell it adds +1 to the wanted population of the cell, then adds the randomized number.

 

I think it would help with the complaints of " I like dealing with a horde moving in on my base every once in awhile, but it is every day!"

And complaints of never changing distribution like above. And it would give a nice boost to variety each playthrough.

[uberevan]

 

To be perfectly fair, in Ecky's earlier videos he had done a great deal of effort to move a huge number of zombies away from his base by firing a shotgun repeatedly and moving away to the south-east towards the middle of the city, hence why there's a huge gap between the nearly empty surrounding area of the base, and actual city (where he lured all the zombies away into)..

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

this, but without having empty cities, i think cities needs to be a dangerous area all the times for the gameplay

 

Cities should definitely be dangerous at all times for gameplay, but they don't necessarily have to be inhabited by zombies at all time

[Svarog]

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

I had this randomly happen once (I don't know why, can't replicate) a horde randomly moved in to my forest safehouse. I'm a big fan of the scenario where zombie population goes uniform as opposed to staying in certain cells, especially since after a while, you can actually see the lines that divide the cells... made out of zombies.

As I've said on the forums a few times, I like when games have a sort of progression, my favorite PZ sandbox preset is a preset that gives the player about a month of being able to move around the towns in relative safety, fooling the player into a false sense of security and setting up base near the populated areas with access to supplies, in that time the player will most likely live off of looting, won't even think about farming/trapping/foraging until the difficulty spikes over a week/month (Preferably, it will just be a random horde out of nowhere leaving the player no time to prepare) forcing the player out of the suburbs and into the forest areas, looting is no longer an option as it is too risky to live off of that, time to learn new survival techniques, farming/foraging comes in to play, a few highly risky looting runs will likely be necessary to obtain some resources for building a solid base, breaking up the boredom, when resources are secured, farming can begin and there is safety yet again.

And that's where the game typically ends, you have to actively try to get zombies to threaten you once you've become self sustaining in that stage. The population NEEDS to go uniform after a while, once again forcing the player out of the safety and onto the road, this time with much less permanent solutions, the kind of final stage where you're always threatened and forced into risky situations to survive until you finally die, preferably because you made a mistake (Because of overconfidence or desperation you tried to loot that gas station surrounded by zombies), not because the game just spawned zombies around you (Cheap way of fulfilling "This is how you die").

I imagine this kind of gameplay scenario taking place over a in-game year with at most 30 minute days (I prefer 15 minute days). The last big update really did wonders to help the difficulty for both those who play Survival and those who like to customize everything but I do feel like we're missing the end game element which is zombie population going uniform and becoming high across all cells (As it happens the population in towns can also decrease so it feels organic).

[uberevan]

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

I had this randomly happen once (I don't know why, can't replicate) a horde randomly moved in to my forest safehouse. I'm a big fan of the scenario where zombie population goes uniform as opposed to staying in certain cells, especially since after a while, you can actually see the lines that divide the cells... made out of zombies.

As I've said on the forums a few times, I like when games have a sort of progression, my favorite PZ sandbox preset is a preset that gives the player about a month of being able to move around the towns in relative safety, fooling the player into a false sense of security and setting up base near the populated areas with access to supplies, in that time the player will most likely live off of looting, won't even think about farming/trapping/foraging until the difficulty spikes over a week/month (Preferably, it will just be a random horde out of nowhere leaving the player no time to prepare) forcing the player out of the suburbs and into the forest areas, looting is no longer an option as it is too risky to live off of that, time to learn new survival techniques, farming/foraging comes in to play, a few highly risky looting runs will likely be necessary to obtain some resources for building a solid base, breaking up the boredom, when resources are secured, farming can begin and there is safety yet again.

And that's where the game typically ends, you have to actively try to get zombies to threaten you once you've become self sustaining in that stage. The population NEEDS to go uniform after a while, once again forcing the player out of the safety and onto the road, this time with much less permanent solutions, the kind of final stage where you're always threatened and forced into risky situations to survive until you finally die, preferably because you made a mistake (Because of overconfidence or desperation you tried to loot that gas station surrounded by zombies), not because the game just spawned zombies around you (Cheap way of fulfilling "This is how you die").

I imagine this kind of gameplay scenario taking place over a in-game year with at most 30 minute days (I prefer 15 minute days). The last big update really did wonders to help the difficulty for both those who play Survival and those who like to customize everything but I do feel like we're missing the end game element which is zombie population going uniform and becoming high across all cells (As it happens the population in towns can also decrease so it feels organic).

 

Another thing that would help add this feeling is to add more threats than just Zombies.  If feral hogs invade your home or NPC's burn it down it's another push factor that adds to the feeling you desire

[Joshnpk]

The day we have dynamic zombie distribution will be IMO the greatest day in Zomboid history.

[A guy and his cat]

 

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

I had this randomly happen once (I don't know why, can't replicate) a horde randomly moved in to my forest safehouse. I'm a big fan of the scenario where zombie population goes uniform as opposed to staying in certain cells, especially since after a while, you can actually see the lines that divide the cells... made out of zombies.

As I've said on the forums a few times, I like when games have a sort of progression, my favorite PZ sandbox preset is a preset that gives the player about a month of being able to move around the towns in relative safety, fooling the player into a false sense of security and setting up base near the populated areas with access to supplies, in that time the player will most likely live off of looting, won't even think about farming/trapping/foraging until the difficulty spikes over a week/month (Preferably, it will just be a random horde out of nowhere leaving the player no time to prepare) forcing the player out of the suburbs and into the forest areas, looting is no longer an option as it is too risky to live off of that, time to learn new survival techniques, farming/foraging comes in to play, a few highly risky looting runs will likely be necessary to obtain some resources for building a solid base, breaking up the boredom, when resources are secured, farming can begin and there is safety yet again.

And that's where the game typically ends, you have to actively try to get zombies to threaten you once you've become self sustaining in that stage. The population NEEDS to go uniform after a while, once again forcing the player out of the safety and onto the road, this time with much less permanent solutions, the kind of final stage where you're always threatened and forced into risky situations to survive until you finally die, preferably because you made a mistake (Because of overconfidence or desperation you tried to loot that gas station surrounded by zombies), not because the game just spawned zombies around you (Cheap way of fulfilling "This is how you die").

I imagine this kind of gameplay scenario taking place over a in-game year with at most 30 minute days (I prefer 15 minute days). The last big update really did wonders to help the difficulty for both those who play Survival and those who like to customize everything but I do feel like we're missing the end game element which is zombie population going uniform and becoming high across all cells (As it happens the population in towns can also decrease so it feels organic).

 

Another thing that would help add this feeling is to add more threats than just Zombies.  If feral hogs invade your home or NPC's burn it down it's another push factor that adds to the feeling you desire

 

 

The sense of constant danger is as you and the one above you said, important and inherent to a game of this nature. How many games have that final stage of "Too OP to worry"? A lot, or even almost all. The uniform zed.pop could be customisable.

[Global_Meltdown]

 

 

I see your point though - I would really love an expanded, dynamic system that would turn zombie distribution into uniform after a few months into apocalypse and "create" random groups of 100+ zombies that actively roam around the area non-stop. 

I had this randomly happen once (I don't know why, can't replicate) a horde randomly moved in to my forest safehouse. I'm a big fan of the scenario where zombie population goes uniform as opposed to staying in certain cells, especially since after a while, you can actually see the lines that divide the cells... made out of zombies.

As I've said on the forums a few times, I like when games have a sort of progression, my favorite PZ sandbox preset is a preset that gives the player about a month of being able to move around the towns in relative safety, fooling the player into a false sense of security and setting up base near the populated areas with access to supplies, in that time the player will most likely live off of looting, won't even think about farming/trapping/foraging until the difficulty spikes over a week/month (Preferably, it will just be a random horde out of nowhere leaving the player no time to prepare) forcing the player out of the suburbs and into the forest areas, looting is no longer an option as it is too risky to live off of that, time to learn new survival techniques, farming/foraging comes in to play, a few highly risky looting runs will likely be necessary to obtain some resources for building a solid base, breaking up the boredom, when resources are secured, farming can begin and there is safety yet again.

And that's where the game typically ends, you have to actively try to get zombies to threaten you once you've become self sustaining in that stage. The population NEEDS to go uniform after a while, once again forcing the player out of the safety and onto the road, this time with much less permanent solutions, the kind of final stage where you're always threatened and forced into risky situations to survive until you finally die, preferably because you made a mistake (Because of overconfidence or desperation you tried to loot that gas station surrounded by zombies), not because the game just spawned zombies around you (Cheap way of fulfilling "This is how you die").

I imagine this kind of gameplay scenario taking place over a in-game year with at most 30 minute days (I prefer 15 minute days). The last big update really did wonders to help the difficulty for both those who play Survival and those who like to customize everything but I do feel like we're missing the end game element which is zombie population going uniform and becoming high across all cells (As it happens the population in towns can also decrease so it feels organic).

 

Another thing that would help add this feeling is to add more threats than just Zombies.  If feral hogs invade your home or NPC's burn it down it's another push factor that adds to the feeling you desire

 

Just as long as it doesn't happen to any of the snowflakes on a MP server. Cause then creating a dynamic chaos you are a griefer. I have long thought/posted in other threads that we need some other element(PvP/Bad Guys) to make it more interesting. 

 

That mainly applies to the game in it's current state, I'm sure it will change once NPC's are released. Though I think about my experiences playing most games Vs NPC's and my experiences playing against RL people. Usually AI get's boring unless they are aggressive and slightly predictive to human behavior or at least swiftly responsive to human behavior to imitate a higher form of AI.

 

Do I have doubts both ways about it? Yes. Which is why I would really love another playable perspective. Don't we all have more fun in the games we play together, as opposed to limited AI? Of course because it's only Human to want to share these experiences even if it is a story driven game. The lack of expectation creates a unique element of surprise to players when a human does something that can't be simulated by AI.

 

Not knocking NPC's, I've just often been disappointed in the past by our(people/humans/developers) ability to render NPC's in most games, in  such a way the mimic's the human response........ a spontaneous one. Often times patterns and triggers become predictable and obvious to us removing one of the most engaging parts of our mind. The lack of knowledge=Fear. I would definitely play into that for a more unique experience.

 

Though so far I think they are on the right path(Otherwise what would take so long?) so keep working hard on perfecting them, no qualms here on waiting.