Replacement/Addition to Alarm System - Noise during Looting

[Kolourblynd]

So while playing I noticed that, when the power is off for the city, the buildings are still alarmed and go off, something a lot of people believe is taking away from the immersion of the atmosphere. During my contemptations about how to deal with this, and messing with my skills at the time, I came up with an idea that makes sense, especially for the long run for gameplay and possibly for MP as well.

Instead of relying on alarms alone for an audio cue for zeds to swarm a location, put a small change to cause a more subtle "looting alarm" for players looking through loot locations. It could be a sound cue that plays and attracts zeds to the loot location similar to alarms, but has a smaller radius and could be linked to a skill, particularly Nimble or Stealth, so that the audio cue goes from something like a shelf falling at level 0 to a small box or can falling over at level 5, with changing radius of effect for each.

 

I imagine that, with the large majority of locations you can loot, the chances for this "alarm" to be caused would be fairly small, something like 1 in every 250 locations or something, and maybe depending on the loot location, such as small shelfs over appliances, there could be a higher chance for "failure," causing the player to act quickly and stay on his/her toes. Not to completely remove alarms from the end of the game, as generators are planned for implementation, so they could theoretically be powered by "invisible generators" we just don't see yet, but I think this addition could really help immerse the player more than the usual alarm.

[Crisisbattl]

I like it and it could work as long is the radius is small (don't know how small maybe just to the house across the street) as the sound coming from the house (even from a shelf falling) would be fairly muffled providing the doors/windows were closed and the insulation was intact.

[ApolloDiaspora]

State of Decay did something similar to this. When looting a container, by holding down a hotkey, the player character slowly, methodically searched through the items, causing a small amount of noise in a small radius. enough to pull a zombie in close who was standing just outside a window, for example. When holding down shift+hotkey to search, the amount of time taken to search a container went down dramatically, but made significantly more noise over a larger radius. Not only that, but there was a chance to make a really loud noise, with a high chance of pulling a very large group of zombies towards your position (spawning them in I believe) in addition to pulling any in the immediate area.

 

It all came down to risk and reward, while balancing the player's impatience. Sure, you could frantically rifle through a cabinet in the hopes of finding ammunition to fight off the zombies who chased you into the house, but that came at the risk of pulling in even more unwanted company.

 

If anything similar to what you suggest was implemented in Project Zomboid, it would have to follow the same pattern of risk and reward. Sure, you can sneak into the West point hardware store, around and behind some of those large urban hordes, but when carefully lifting that axe off the shelf you accidentally tip over a nearby shovel. Thunk. Suddenly, taking the time to slowly pull the hordes out of the town centre, instead of sneaking in like a shortsighted, overweight ninja, seems like a much better idea.

 

Finally, given the state of the inventory system as-is, any 'looting noise' should be made when removing an item from a container, rather then simply looking at the contents, maybe even balance it out based on the player's skills and the size/weight of the item being moved. Otherwise, sneaking past a row of bookshelves to check for skill books (and similar events that shouldn't make much noise) could break the immersion entirely.

[Daec]

State of Decay did something similar to this. When looting a container, by holding down a hotkey, the player character slowly, methodically searched through the items, causing a small amount of noise in a small radius. enough to pull a zombie in close who was standing just outside a window, for example. When holding down shift+hotkey to search, the amount of time taken to search a container went down dramatically, but made significantly more noise over a larger radius. Not only that, but there was a chance to make a really loud noise, with a high chance of pulling a very large group of zombies towards your position (spawning them in I believe) in addition to pulling any in the immediate area.

It all came down to risk and reward, while balancing the player's impatience. Sure, you could frantically rifle through a cabinet in the hopes of finding ammunition to fight off the zombies who chased you into the house, but that came at the risk of pulling in even more unwanted company.

If anything similar to what you suggest was implemented in Project Zomboid, it would have to follow the same pattern of risk and reward. Sure, you can sneak into the West point hardware store, around and behind some of those large urban hordes, but when carefully lifting that axe off the shelf you accidentally tip over a nearby shovel. Thunk. Suddenly, taking the time to slowly pull the hordes out of the town centre, instead of sneaking in like a shortsighted, overweight ninja, seems like a much better idea.

Finally, given the state of the inventory system as-is, any 'looting noise' should be made when removing an item from a container, rather then simply looking at the contents, maybe even balance it out based on the player's skills and the size/weight of the item being moved. Otherwise, sneaking past a row of bookshelves to check for skill books (and similar events that shouldn't make much noise) could break the immersion entirely.

I like this

[Anvilman6]

So while playing I noticed that, when the power is off for the city, the buildings are still alarmed and go off, something a lot of people believe is taking away from the immersion of the atmosphere. During my contemptations about how to deal with this, and messing with my skills at the time, I came up with an idea that makes sense, especially for the long run for gameplay and possibly for MP as well.

Instead of relying on alarms alone for an audio cue for zeds to swarm a location, put a small change to cause a more subtle "looting alarm" for players looking through loot locations. It could be a sound cue that plays and attracts zeds to the loot location similar to alarms, but has a smaller radius and could be linked to a skill, particularly Nimble or Stealth, so that the audio cue goes from something like a shelf falling at level 0 to a small box or can falling over at level 5, with changing radius of effect for each.

 

I imagine that, with the large majority of locations you can loot, the chances for this "alarm" to be caused would be fairly small, something like 1 in every 250 locations or something, and maybe depending on the loot location, such as small shelfs over appliances, there could be a higher chance for "failure," causing the player to act quickly and stay on his/her toes. Not to completely remove alarms from the end of the game, as generators are planned for implementation, so they could theoretically be powered by "invisible generators" we just don't see yet, but I think this addition could really help immerse the player more than the usual alarm.

Could be an interesting system. I do admit that burglar alarms (especially the ones that seem to reset in MP) get rather tedious.

[Kolourblynd]

I actually had originally gotten the idea from SoD, even though I kind of disliked the system implemented in the game; It only increased the odds, and for some odd reason I would be REALLY unlucky early on in difficult playthroughs.

I just think there should be a chance overall for it to happen, because it would probably take a bit to long to have a "looting phase" for each and every loot table, but I'd imagine if they added more functionality for tools like Crowbars and such, I don't see why they couldn't follow a similar system. The only issue I have with it in PZ is that some loot locations are really best looted by standing nearby and opening up the inventory, which is probably the least likely interaction the Devs would want to revert to when trying to implement a system of "looting," but I'd bet that the way the player loots stuff might end up different in the final version of the game anyways, so we shall see!

[Kurruk]

I actually had originally gotten the idea from SoD, even though I kind of disliked the system implemented in the game; It only increased the odds, and for some odd reason I would be REALLY unlucky early on in difficult playthroughs.

The reason why you would've been "unlucky" is that system depends on the skill, at least AFAIR there was something within one of the skills to ease looting and make it less noticeable, but I can be wrong

[123Imirish]

 

Could be an interesting system. I do admit that burglar alarms (especially the ones that seem to reset in MP) get rather tedious.

 

Oh Anvilman6, I remember when you had just three posts, why how you have grown, 

[Anvilman6]

 

 

Could be an interesting system. I do admit that burglar alarms (especially the ones that seem to reset in MP) get rather tedious.

 

Oh Anvilman6, I remember when you had just three posts, why how you have grown, 

 

Always willing to try and get more involved in the community of a fantastic game.

[xGamache]

+1 looting noise seems reasonable based on item/ container being looted

[retepultimate]

I just can imagine myself looting a house and that then suddenly a chair would

Gall over and alert all zombies outside

[tomtentp]

I like the idea. But what about if you make sounds by actually bumping into stuff, rather than when moving stuff from loot window to inventory window.

 

Like if you are a little hasty and rush up to a fridge and runs into the fridge which cause a thump sound.

 

Or if you rush by a chair in 100km/h and it'll make a moving-chair-on-floor sound.

 

This would cause you to be less of a marathon runner and more of a sneaky thief, which would be more like the case in reality I think.

 

 

EDIT:

I think this would make it more of a player skill rather than a dice roll. I don't like dice rolls.

 

I think you would be very annoyed at your character if he, knowing that there is a mega huge das uber zombie horde outside the door, without you being able to control it, just "tips over a shelf".

 

You would be like "COME ON CHARACTER PERSON THING...... REALLY???"

[deprav]

I like the idea just above this post, having to be more careful not to bump into stuff when trying to be sneaky. How many times I've cleaned houses from kitchen to bedrooms in 30s. The amount of noise indoor being related to your own haste/speed is something I like a lot, the clumsy/graceful traits would take a lot of sense as well !

Tho I don't think that's something in contradication with the OP's idea. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the OP was mentionning some more "map related" noises than "skill related" noises. Like no one would suspect that shelf isn't properly fixed to the wall and going through the books would break it, or that grabbing a knife on that messy table would make that spoon fall on the floor, or that a mess of tins and glass bottles was waiting for you behind that door, or even that the door hinges were old and would squeak like a scream in the night, or this window wasn't properly manufactured and would shut itself in a loud clapping noise, or the good old creaking stairs etc... You see my point ;o

 

That's something I mentionned on a "what would you like to see in the map?" thread on the discussion board but it actually suits this suggestion : more garbage and "apocalyptic mess" in the street that would make noise when stepped on, such as broken glass, empty cans of food rolling on the floor if you step on it etc...

 

Tho I don't see that as a "replacement" for alarms, I freaking love alarms ;D I'm even thrilling for more alarms when dead cars are scattered accross the map.

[psykikk]

in SOD increasing loot speed also meant decrease of total amount of loot.

but in SOD the total amount of loot available (locations and items to be found) is also significantly lower than in PZ.

 

so... I like the idea.

 the base chance you make some noise should depend on 

-the items spawned and looted

-the skill of the character

 

plus a multipler of

-container looted

 

 

so searching through a wooden crte filled with nails and barbed wire maybe makes more noise than going through a 

bookshelf filled with books

[deprav]

Hmmm, what kind of "character skill" ?
 

I'd think it should be more about a "character trait", like Clumsy (which would be much more dramatic and deserve more than -1), it's opposite Graceful (which is more related to character's move if I got it right), and maybe adding a couple of traits like "Dexterous" and "Butterfingered" when it comes to in-container noise and looting.

 

 I don't see a "discret looting skill" you could level up being implemented, that would be creating skills just for the sake of it and wouldn't make much sense.

 

[psykikk]

I meant traits. *sigh*

 

nitpicky are we not ?

 

 

BUT.. I do believe that omnce you get certain experience, you will make less noise.. so why not more skills ? 

if they stick to the theme ? 

[Kurruk]

I agree here with deprav - there is no point in adding searching specific skill as it's not vital and not sure how would you get better at it anyway. The best way would be just like with loot itself - leave it to RNGods.

[Daec]

I agree here with deprav - there is no point in adding searching specific skill as it's not vital and not sure how would you get better at it anyway. The best way would be just like with loot itself - leave it to RNGods.

But there's this other suggestion of an "survivalist skill" wich was received pretty good afaik. This skill would play into this pretty well i think. So there woulnd't have to be a New "loot skill" created.

http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/6671-new-skill-survivor/

[Kurruk]

 

I agree here with deprav - there is no point in adding searching specific skill as it's not vital and not sure how would you get better at it anyway. The best way would be just like with loot itself - leave it to RNGods.

But there's this other suggestion of an "survivalist skill" wich was received pretty good afaik. This skill would play into this pretty well i think. So there woulnd't have to be a New "loot skill" created.

http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/6671-new-skill-survivor/

 

Every other skill I think is connected to one visible trait/action, but that one might be too overpowered:

- panic

- food/water

- sleep

- looting noise

[tomtentp]

 

 

I agree here with deprav - there is no point in adding searching specific skill as it's not vital and not sure how would you get better at it anyway. The best way would be just like with loot itself - leave it to RNGods.

But there's this other suggestion of an "survivalist skill" wich was received pretty good afaik. This skill would play into this pretty well i think. So there woulnd't have to be a New "loot skill" created.

http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/6671-new-skill-survivor/

 

Every other skill I think is connected to one visible trait/action, but that one might be too overpowered:

- panic

- food/water

- sleep

- looting noise

 

 

You mean the Survivalist skill?

 

Well it depends on how good the buffs are.

 

And also, I think it should be implemented as a passive buff (hiddern or not) rather than a skill. So everyone get the same "hardening" as thier character progresses. This will also add to the tragedy of losing your hard earned character at the event of death.

[Thuztor]

Nose during looting is a nice idea.

 

But I want to say something about the alarm systems.

Alarms should be linked to alarm system objects in the houses, in my opinion.

With this then also alarms in e.g. hermit huts and pit latrines were excluded.

And with a control panel you can reactived the alarms.