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Rotate Map


Magusyk

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Welcome to the forum! :)

 

http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/192-commonly-suggested-suggestions-read-before-posting/

 

Heya guys, I'm going to throw together a quick list of things that are commonly suggested and whether they've been mentioned by devs as tentative or no's. I'm going to be basing this off of a few threads in the old forum and the top of my head. If I miss any please mention it in the thread and I'll add it to the list.

 

Key

[n] - This is a confirmed 'No' from the development team. Please don't waste your time or ours reposting unless there's something relevant and new about it

[y] - This is confirmed 'Yes' from the development team. This is something the definitely want to see in the game, but this does not constitute a guarantee. Please don't post about it unless you have something new or relevant to add.

[m] - This is a 'maybe' from the dev team. It's something they've mentioned that they were interested in but we still don't know if it's a confirmed feature. Please don't post about it unless you have something new or relevant to add.

Everything else - everything not marked would be something overwhelmingly decided by the community or that's self-evident. If you feel it needs discussion bring it up here or in a thread if there's not already one out there.

 

The Big No's!

These are a list of things that are either vehemently opposed by the majority of the community, confirmed "no's" by the dev team, or impossible within the game as it is. I'm going to try to make this completely unbiased, but if you disagree with anything posted feel free to mention it. The most important ones are highlighted in red. If you take nothing else from this thread, please pay attention to these.

 

 

         Aerosol Can + Lighter = Flamethrower

[n]    Beginning the game before the infection

[n]    Children or babies

[n]    An ending or any game over other than death

[n]    First Person or any other viewpoint changes

[n]    Immunity/Cure

[n]    Military Aid

        Mini Maps

[n]    Morality or Karma meter

          Nudity

          Nukes

[n]    Overpowered weapons/specific firearms

          Overpowered Vehicles/Tanks

[n]    Personal Hygiene (going to the bathroom, etc.)

          Playing as a zombie

[n]    Porting/Console Version

[n]    Random generated maps

[n]    Rape

[n]    Respawning/Quicksaving

[n]    Sex

[n]    "Special" Infected or any type of superhuman zombies

          Specific named weapons (such as AK47, M14, etc.)

[n]    Unlimited/large amounts of ammo and weapons

[n]    Voiceover

[n]    Zombie Beasts or Infected Animals

[n]    Zombie Camo, or Using Zombie Guts as a Disguise

 

 

Already a No.

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I'd like to see it, but it's not going to happen - at least not for a long time. This post from another thread sums up the why's and wherefore's quite nicely: -

It essentially still can't happen (rotation or other points of view). The simple version of why is that things still aren't going to have bottom or side textures, and having to go through not only making all of those, but also making their map tools able to handle them would be more work than it's worth at this point.

http://theindiestone.com/forums/index.php/topic/4222-a-question-or-two-about-the-3-d-engine/

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[n]    First Person or any other viewpoint changes

 

Was not looking for 1st person or other viewpoint changes. I was not aware that a rotated map constituits a view point change but OK anyway.


Thank YOu Ewok, clears that right up. :)

 

Happy Surviving

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[n] First Person or any other viewpoint changes

Yeah - I agree that's a bit open to interpretation. Is rotating the existing view a 'change'? Like you, I didn't initially read it that way, but when I found Rath's post it kind of made sense and fell into place.

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[n] First Person or any other viewpoint changes

Yeah - I agree that's a bit open to interpretation. Is rotating the existing view a 'change'? Like you, I didn't initially read it that way, but when I found Rath's post it kind of made sense and fell into place.

 

 

It's little confusing and of course open to interpretation. I think rotating-/free- or anglecam(?) are viewpoint changes.

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It's simple: If you rotate the camera around 45 °, also each object has to rotate by 45 °.

That means, every object in the game, even junk on the street must have at least four textures.

 

Simple once explained, but divvies like me have no knowledge of how objects are modelled in a game engine. :P

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  • 2 months later...

Must have missed that in the suggestions thread. Its dissapointing really. Right now its really annoying to do any carpentery below you due to that opaque thingy that makes walls dissapear. Having to walk around to plaster/sledge a wall due to it being invisible is terrible, especially if wall is on a 2nd or higher floor. Also being unable to sledge/use furniture/sinks that are near walls below you. Is there anything planned, say, being able to toggle the orb on/of to help with this issue?

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  • 4 months later...

Well, I've read a few topics about viewpoints and game engine, but some things still look unclear.

I understand why the engine doesn't allow free camera rotation and 1-st person view. But my suggestion is just making four switchable viewpoints (90° rotations). This will not require changing the engine. Basically, to rotate the view 90° or 180° you only need to swap map axis according to the viewpoint and re-render all tiles and 3D models with new rotation. So, the only possible problem can occur if the tileset is incomplete (for example, if some pieces of furniture don't have all four tile variants), but as far as I've seen in game, most of the tiles are OK.

Doing this would remove some inconveniences. For example, you can't destroy wall tile with sledgehammer if you are behind the wall. But if you rotate the camera 180°, you will no longer be behind the wall, so you should be able to destroy it.

So the question is: is the 90° camera rotation also impossible, or is it something that we'll have a chance to get?

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Well, I've read a few topics about viewpoints and game engine, but some things still look unclear.

I understand why the engine doesn't allow free camera rotation and 1-st person view. But my suggestion is just making four switchable viewpoints (90° rotations). This will not require changing the engine. Basically, to rotate the view 90° or 180° you only need to swap map axis according to the viewpoint and re-render all tiles and 3D models with new rotation. So, the only possible problem can occur if the tileset is incomplete (for example, if some pieces of furniture don't have all four tile variants), but as far as I've seen in game, most of the tiles are OK.

Doing this would remove some inconveniences. For example, you can't destroy wall tile with sledgehammer if you are behind the wall. But if you rotate the camera 180°, you will no longer be behind the wall, so you should be able to destroy it.

So the question is: is the 90° camera rotation also impossible, or is it something that we'll have a chance to get?

Walls don't really have an "outside" and "inside" texture.

If you rotate the angle with the walls as they are, inside textures would suddenly be on the outside, etc.

Furniture would also be an issue for the reasons you've mentioned.

From what I've gathered, it's a consideration for the far future well after Early Access. Not a definite yes, though. But not a definite no (for all that I know), either.

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Yep, I think I remember reading a post written by Lemmy explaining the "2D to full 3D" change the game undergoes on the long term.

Logic wants that once the game is fully converted to 3D, rotating the camera will be possible. No more zombies hidding in front of your line of sight because of the camera angle ;o

The 3D engine that was proposed (and may not even still be on the table) wouldn't have chaned the art assets anyways, so it still would have required a tremendous amount of work.

Now that it's shelved, the rotating view feels pretty safe to put back on the "no" list unless we hear something specific about it.

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The 3D engine that was proposed (and may not even still be on the table) wouldn't have chaned the art assets anyways, so it still would have required a tremendous amount of work.

Now that it's shelved, the rotating view feels pretty safe to put back on the "no" list unless we hear something specific about it.

I don't think it's off the table. It's just fairly low on the priority list when there have been optimisations elsewhere.

It was on the cards to first implement 3d floors and walls with stuff like sofas, shelves, etc remaining basically billboard polys, which would require the viewpoint to be fixed, still.

In the long run, the remaining tiles would slowly be converted to 3d. Once everything was 3d, a rotating camera would become a possibility.

As far as I can tell it remained on the roadmap but is simply just a long term thing.

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Well, the devs said no, then maybe as a side effect of the possible 3D modeling. As long as there's no need for that to happen, we don't have much reason to think this will, either. But you're right, it's not a "definite" no anymore. I'll probably put it with the maybes for the actual list, I was just speaking more in general terms of "no this doesn't need to be suggested" (just like things that are yes's like cars). There's no new info about it, no further discussion to be had, so best we can do is wait and see.

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  • 1 year later...

I think the rotation people are talking about is every 90°, a little like old The Sims games or SimCity 2000.

Maybe a language barrier made it less clear.

 

Now, I'm not a programmer or anything but I believe every object on the map has a coordinate based on an XY axis.

Rotating the camera every 90° would only change the + and - values (I don't think I'm crazy am I?).

Don't know how much "horsepower" would take to do it though.

 

Of course, If the game is built on other physics principals it could make it impossible to even think to rotate the map.

 

Have you guys even tried it?

Is would be SO AWESOME!!! With a compass and everything...

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I honestly wish the devs went for full 3D when they had the chance, Just imagine the possibilities. Full 3D terrain, Tree's with canopies, River banks. Sweet Jesus that would have been amazing. I would love it if they revisited the idea so they could do it in some degree or maybe just go all out and convert everything to 3D. A man can dream.

Edited by xXSly_WolfyXx
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2 hours ago, joaojotta said:

I think the rotation people are talking about is every 90°, a little like old The Sims games or SimCity 2000.

Maybe a language barrier made it less clear.

 

Now, I'm not a programmer or anything but I believe every object on the map has a coordinate based on an XY axis.

Rotating the camera every 90° would only change the + and - values (I don't think I'm crazy am I?).

Don't know how much "horsepower" would take to do it though.

 

Of course, If the game is built on other physics principals it could make it impossible to even think to rotate the map.

 

Have you guys even tried it?

Is would be SO AWESOME!!! With a compass and everything...

 

Its already been explained in detail why this wouldn't be possible in this thread. There's not much else we can say about it. 

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6 hours ago, xXSly_WolfyXx said:

I honestly wish the devs went for full 3D when they had the chance, Just imagine the possibilities. Full 3D terrain, Tree's with canopies, River banks. Sweet Jesus that would have been amazing. I would love it if they revisited the idea so they could do it in some degree or maybe just go all out and convert everything to 3D. A man can dream.

I agree... Don't get me wrong, I like the style, but it would be really cool 3D. I dunno, maybe after 1.0 we'll get something. Also, if they plan on realistic vehicle physics, it's going to look really weird with a 3D car and proper physics driving around isometric tiles. 

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1 hour ago, Spracky said:

I agree... Don't get me wrong, I like the style, but it would be really cool 3D. I dunno, maybe after 1.0 we'll get something. Also, if they plan on realistic vehicle physics, it's going to look really weird with a 3D car and proper physics driving around isometric tiles. 

Exactly, In the long run it would be so worth it.

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I'm pretty sure I would have just passed on Project Zomboid if it didn't have the fixed, isometric camera and pixelated graphics. along with the K&B story and a commitment to simulating large numbers of zombies on screen, that's the main reason I'm here, really.

 

Just wouldn't have felt the same as a fully 3D world with a rotate-able camera. It also means we don't have to play tag with the camera to interact with and find objects in the game.

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