Can we get some more clarification regarding the 'Modding Policy'?

[Aimi-ch]

To see what I am referring to, see here: https://projectzomboid.com/blog/modding-policy/

I am a modder for an undisclosed project and I believe that while these new guidelines are in good faith, there are some massive oversights regarding what content is and is not allowed.

 

2.2. Mod content. You are allowed to edit Project Zomboid in any way you want, provided that you do not:

2.2.2. create nor publish content that is objectionable and inappropriate. This includes but is not limited to content that is intentionally offensive, abusive, obscene, discriminatory, racist, pornographic, aimed to harass someone or a group of people, threatening, hateful, xenophobic, invasive to the privacy of another person or group of people, sexist, and/or defamatory.

 

I have no issue with most of these, 'no racism' seems fair enough, but I don't understand why 'pornographic' and 'obscene' is included here.

First of all, is this just an oversight? I don't understand why this would be singled out.

Second, what does this cover? Do mods that add more detailed nude bodies count as obscene or pornographic? Does graphic sex between NPCs/players count as pornographic? If yes, why would that be against the modding guidelines? Do these guidelines only apply to the Steam Workshop, or does it apply to all mods released anywhere?

 

6. Representations and Warranties

6.1. You represent and warrant that:

6.1.1. your mod does not violate Valve’s Mod Content Usage Policy, the Steam Subscriber Agreement, or our Project Zomboid Terms and Conditions;

 

Does this mean that The Indie Stone will be taking action, legal or otherwise, against any mods violating above terms in any platform? To put it in simple terms, will the developers be shutting down sex mods from being shared in sites like LoversLab, that's what I'm asking.
And to add onto that question, how do you plan to enforce these terms outside of the Steam Workshop?

And to add onto the above question, will you be revoking game access from players who develop these mods that break your terms of service? To be more clear, I am talking about any mods published outside of the Steam Workshop. I can understand not wanting NSFW content in your official Steam Workshop page. I want to know if The Indie Stone is going to chase mod developers out of the community, be it SFW or NSFW ones, for developing NSFW content that they disagree with.

 

1. Your responsibility

1.2. Users of mods are responsible for their usage of mods – we don’t check them, and we can’t be responsible for them.

 

Just making sure, does this specifically mean that players will not be punished for playing with any mods that might break the above terms of use? Can a player face any sort of punishment for playing with a mod that adds explicit sex into the game?

[EnigmaGrey]

This is standard language for most EULAs and conforms to Steams own guidelines.

 

 I don’t think there’s much else to say on this? Going into enforcement action, suing .etc is boxing everyone in, but suffice to say, if you upload pornography to Steam and it gets reported to them, Steam would remove it (per their own eula).

[Aimi-ch]

1 hour ago, EnigmaGrey said:

This is standard language for most EULAs and conforms to Steams own guidelines.

 

 I don’t think there’s much else to say on this? Going into enforcement action, suing .etc is boxing everyone in, but suffice to say, if you upload pornography to Steam and it gets reported to them, Steam would remove it (per their own eula).

 

Not really no, there's a reason I specifically mentioned mods outside the Steam ecosystem. I want to know if the developers will be going after any explicit/NSFW mods released outside of Steam. I didn't even mention suing like you did, a simple "NSFW mods are allowed outside of the Steam ecosystem." or a "NSFW mods are not allowed at all and we will be doing our best to take them down." would suffice. I'm not asking for anything unreasonable, I'm just asking you to clarify your own terms of services. Once again;

Do these guidelines only apply to the Steam Workshop, or does it apply to all mods released anywhere, on platforms like the LoversLab?

What counts as pornographic? Between mods that add revealing clothing, nude body mods and mods that add full-on sex, where do we draw the line? Or are you intentionally leaving this definition vague so you can enforce it as you wish?

Will you be revoking game access from players who develop these mods that break your terms of service? To be more clear, I am talking about any mods published outside of the Steam Workshop to platforms like the LoversLab.

Once again, none of these unreasonable questions. I have an obligation as a player to abide by these rules, and you have an obligation as the service provider to clarify and enforce these rules where you see fit. It's absolutely not unreasonable to ask the service provider what exactly is allowed and what exactly is not.

[nasKo]

4 hours ago, Aimi-ch said:

First of all, is this just an oversight?

No, not an oversight.

 

4 hours ago, Aimi-ch said:

Second, what does this cover? Do mods that add more detailed nude bodies count as obscene or pornographic? Does graphic sex between NPCs/players count as pornographic?

Yes, graphic sex is pornographic. No, a nude body is not pornographic.

 

4 hours ago, Aimi-ch said:

If yes, why would that be against the modding guidelines?

 

It's not content we want our game to be associated with.

 

4 hours ago, Aimi-ch said:

Does this mean that The Indie Stone will be taking action, legal or otherwise, against any mods violating above terms in any platform? To put it in simple terms, will the developers be shutting down sex mods from being shared in sites like LoversLab, that's what I'm asking.

The document serves as legal groundwork; "covering our asses", in simple terms.

It naturally means we reserve the right to take action against mods that break the ToS and/or Modding Policy where we see fit.

You will never hear a company go "Ah nah we just put it there to cover our asses but we won't actually bother doing anything about it wink wink" since that would nullify that aspect of the relevant terms/policy legally.

 

4 hours ago, Aimi-ch said:

Just making sure, does this specifically mean that players will not be punished for playing with any mods that might break the above terms of use? Can a player face any sort of punishment for playing with a mod that adds explicit sex into the game?

 

We wouldn't know if they're playing with the mod or not.

 

1 hour ago, Aimi-ch said:

 

I want to know if the developers will be going after any explicit/NSFW mods released outside of Steam. I didn't even mention suing like you did, a simple "NSFW mods are allowed outside of the Steam ecosystem." or a "NSFW mods are not allowed at all and we will be doing our best to take them down." would suffice. I'm not asking for anything unreasonable, I'm just asking you to clarify your own terms of services. Once again;

Mods that are not allowed on the Steam Workshop can exist outside of it. The Terms of Service and Modding Policy still apply to them regardless of where they are published.

 

1 hour ago, Aimi-ch said:

 

Do these guidelines only apply to the Steam Workshop, or does it apply to all mods released anywhere, on platforms like the LoversLab?

No, they are not specific to the Steam Workshop, they are a policy for modding the game.

[Aimi-ch]

1 hour ago, nasKo said:

No, not an oversight.

 

Yes, graphic sex is pornographic. No, a nude body is not pornographic.

 

It's not content we want our game to be associated with.

 

The document serves as legal groundwork; "covering our asses", in simple terms.

It naturally means we reserve the right to take action against mods that break the ToS and/or Modding Policy where we see fit.

You will never hear a company go "Ah nah we just put it there to cover our asses but we won't actually bother doing anything about it wink wink" since that would nullify that aspect of the relevant terms/policy legally.

 

We wouldn't know if they're playing with the mod or not.

 

Mods that are not allowed on the Steam Workshop can exist outside of it. The Terms of Service and Modding Policy still apply to them regardless of where they are published.

 

No, they are not specific to the Steam Workshop, they are a policy for modding the game.

 

That sucks, no NSFW mods at all then. Thank you for the quick response at least, a lot of devs like to keep this stuff vague while taking down mods left and right. I genuinely appreciate the communication, thank you and have a nice day.