ORGM Rechambered
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2 minutes ago, Fenris_Wolf said:

Thats nuts, and annoying (thanks for giving me 1 more reason not to buy from steam!),  and of course! He hasn't updated it yet, and it maybe several days or more til he does.

 

Yeah from what I can work out that's why no mods are showing. :|

 

Awesome, I'll do that and hide it so we can test if it works and then if Ormatn does want to update his one I'll delete my upload.

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The problem I seem to be encountering as to why my server won't start seems to be whenever I load ORGM. I believe I've done the workshop upload right as it works in singleplayer but whenever I host a server it fails.

 

I found this thread: https://steamcommunity.com/app/108600/discussions/5/351660338727475242/ 

 

Which talks about the original ORGM and the lua model loader. Is that something still present that could cause an issue? Given me and my friend did try to host a server with it not as a workshop mod and it kept throwing a wrong version error despite being on the same one.

Edited by Khaos

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None of the model loader files exist in the current version. As far as I was aware it was outdated and no longer required. I'll attempt to fire up a server when I get the chance later today and check it out, however we were using a modified version of the original ORGM (without model loader) on 37.14 without issues. I still need to update my linux version for our dedicated server, I've been slacking.

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14 minutes ago, Fenris_Wolf said:

None of the model loader files exist in the current version. As far as I was aware it was outdated and no longer required. I'll attempt to fire up a server when I get the chance later today and check it out, however we were using a modified version of the original ORGM (without model loader) on 37.14 without issues. I still need to update my linux version for our dedicated server, I've been slacking.

 

Hmmm strange, has anyone else tested hosting a server with this running? Wondering if it's an isolated issue with me or not. I've noticed in every instance reported with the failure to start the server, a dev always asked that the coop_stderr.txt and coop-stdout.txt are requested. Any idea's if they will help diagnose the issue?

Edited by Khaos

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7 minutes ago, Fenris_Wolf said:

If they have, they haven't mentioned it to me. Hopefully I can have a answer for you in a bit, but it may not be relevant since I'm not running the steam version

 

Cancel that all mate, looked at the error file and it was telling me the server couldn't download the file and that was because it was set to friends only. After changing it to public it has now worked. Ever so sorry about that mate it was on my end.

 

This Steam host thing is silly sometimes.

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So now that 2.00 is stable, I figured I should toss around some ideas for ORGM's future. The stuff that's already been done may seem like alot but in truth it was all just groundwork...laying down the foundation so the real construction can begin. Though to be fair, I've already taken it alot farther then my original intent which was to just redo the code base and document it to make it more manageable and easier to edit for the next person to maintain the mod...but once you start mixing firearms and code, I'm hooked :)

Also, this isn't a list of promises, and none of it is set in stone. But just some ideas of things I'd like to accomplish and get feedback on

 

Weapon stats:

Rebalancing these.  Lot of work to be done here, I'm figuring increasing the base chance to hit and lowering damage, while increasing the chance for a critical hit as skill rises. This will allow for players with lower skill levels to still hit something, but with the lower damage it will be less effective. Those skilled would still be able to score the 1 hit kill headshots. One stat I've already tweaked for the next release is that annoyingly unrealistic shotgun spread.

 

Extended and Reduced Capacity Magazines:

This is one of the things ORMntMan was working on for his unfinished version, and had piles of icons made up for some of them already.

The current alternate ammo system could easily be tweaked into a alternate mag system.

 

Ammo Boxes and Canisters:

Another thing ORMntMan appears to have been working on was making boxes and cans function like other reloadables...you need to have a box in inventory and have to load ammo into it. Makes sense...always wonder every time I use the recipe to put spare ammo in a can: where did this magical ammo canister come from? did it spawn from no where? why do I need 500 rounds just to be able to put stuff in it?

 

Gunsmithing Profession:

IRL my first real trained profession was a smith. It would be awesome to play one in game. I know its kinda straying off the mods goal of simply adding real firearms, but it will serve a purpose.  Adding it however will require piles of extra items and tools.

 

Field Stripping and Complete Breakdown:

Not much to be said here, field stripping would break the gun up into major components and make it take up less room in inventory. Smiths and other skilled people could completely break down the gun for parts used in repair or customization of other similar guns.

 

Weapon Upgrades:

The current system bugs me to no end. The fact I can't mount a custom stock, recoil pad and sling on a gun at the same time is just nuts.

I'd have to recode the whole thing in lua, but it would be worth it. Smiths would be able to customize parts as well. Possible upgrades and customization could include: beveled magazine wells on pistols, ergonomic grips, light weight receivers, thread barrels (suppressors, recoil compensators), rechambering kits, and other aftermarket parts.

 

Firearm Inspection Window:

Basically a small popup window activated on a hotkey, showing a basic generic outline image of the gun type, stats and current upgrades installed.  It would be necessary if implementing a new upgrade system. Probably also include some quick access buttons like fire mode select and other stuff.

 

Bayonets and Pistol Whipping:

I REALLY want to implement this, but It looks like it could be kinda tricky...thats not going to stop me from trying though ^_^

 

Select Fire Burst Mode:

Should be simple enough to implement.

 

I could go on (I get too many ideas), but thats probably a long enough read for now I'm not writing a novel :mellow:

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4 hours ago, Fenris_Wolf said:

Bayonets and Pistol Whipping:

I REALLY want to implement this, but It looks like it could be kinda tricky...thats not going to stop me from trying though ^_^

 

I wouldn't worry about this one yet as TIS has already shown off bayonet attachments so I'd assume the relevant feature will come in with the animation update. Love the rest of the feature.

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Not sure if you wanted feedback after you maybe implemented those or feedback about the list itself, but too bad, here's my two cents about it all lol.

Weapon stats: Maybe basing the base chance to hit off of (roughly) the effective range of the gun (which is pretty much accuracy) and the recoil of the gun? I would imagine lower recoil guns would be easier for people with a lower aiming skill to use effectively. Everything else sounds pretty good.

Magazines: I'm just gonna agree with everything there

Ammo boxes and canisters: Also gonna agree with it all

Gunsmithing profession: More agreement, but it might also work as a separate mod, though making one along with ORGM Rechambered would mean it'd be easier to link whateter profession skills the profession would have with the vast amount of guns and ammo types. This could also be added in a way with books/magazines that teach necessary skills to better repair guns, add attachments, make ammo, etc.

Field stripping: yeah

Weapon Upgrades: I would love all that, but I can also see how much work it might end up taking, so I wouldn't blame you at all if you didn't change the current system. Also to re-mention suppressors, maybe finding out how the suppressor mod works and then drastically reducing the effectiveness of them (because I'll admit, screwing a homemade suppressor onto a shotgun and not alerting zombies 10 feet away makes me feel kinda bad)

Firearm Inspection Window: If you did this, you should see if it could get added into the base game, because even a very simple gun UI window would be an amazing addition to the base game, and even better with the vast amount of things in this mod.

Bayonets and pistol whipping: If you pull this off then you deserve at least a dozen cookies.

Select fire: also yeah

Short ramblings on each topic from me, but to sum it up, pretty much all of those ideas fall into the category of "making the real guns mod more realistic outside of just the amount of guns and bullet types" and I heavily approve of that. I wish I could code, I'd definitely help out with it, but for now I'll lurk and provide motivation :P

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9 minutes ago, Khaos said:

I wouldn't worry about this one yet as TIS has already shown off bayonet attachments so I'd assume the relevant feature will come in with the animation update. Love the rest of the feature.

Ya...I almost stopped tweaking ORGM a while ago to wait for the new system.. Its low priority atm anyways I experimented for like 5 minutes to test how much work it would take and decided it can wait

 

15 minutes ago, iyarkonan said:

Weapon stats: Maybe basing the base chance to hit off of (roughly) the effective range of the gun (which is pretty much accuracy) and the recoil of the gun? I would imagine lower recoil guns would be easier for people with a lower aiming skill to use effectively. Everything else sounds pretty good.

Caliber recoil effecting accuracy is a definite. The way the alternate ammo system works is by changing the guns stats based on whatever type of round is next to fire. I'm currently expanding on the list of what stats the round changes.  If your revolver is loaded with both .357 and .38 it should modify the sound, the recoil delay between shots, damage, accuracy (in some cases also depending on bullet type some are more accurate), etc. This actually kind of tied in to the weapons upgrade system I'm thinking of as it would pull mod data from that. I think it would actually be easy to.

 

29 minutes ago, iyarkonan said:

Gunsmithing profession: More agreement, but it might also work as a separate mod

Probably best to have it separate. Also with the silencers...10ft is defiantly too short :D

But the silencers I really think should be separate so combining that with the smithing makes sense. Those are actually the 2 I'm most unsure about adding. It would probably also be good to throw the handloading stuff in there.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Fenris_Wolf said:

But the silencers I really think should be separate so combining that with the smithing makes sense. Those are actually the 2 I'm most unsure about adding. It would probably also be good to throw the handloading stuff in there.

 

Is it feasible to add a new option to sandbox settings? Being able to disable or enable spent casings would be fantastic.

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I'll have to poke around in the code and see I haven't looked into sandbox settings yet, servers need some sort of method of configuring ORGM's settings and syncing them with clients that doesnt involve lua edits.  Casings defiantly should be optional.

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I'll apologize for dropping a comment without having read page 2 yet... and I'll apologize again for dropping a comment and poofing, but seeing as my time until finals next week is at a premium... *shakes fist at the Physics Gods ... and the chair of the Physics Dept*

 

 When you do get the gunsmith profession working, are you planning on allowing wheel/breach guns to jam?    Admittedly, revolvers jam *far* less frequently than semi-autos but it's been my experience that when revolvers finally get around to jamming, they're best used as clubs until you can take it to a smith (or take it apart yourself... which is *fun* if you don't have the right tools.)   

Can't speak for breechloaders though, I've neither owned own nor heard from any of my friends who have owned them about anything jam-related for them.  I figure mechanical failure is mechanical failure, and just as the mechanical timing and all the little fun stuff in revolvers loves to hate you, I figure breechloaders should be subject to the same rules of "How bad does the Universe hate you today?" with admittedly even smaller chances due to fewer parts to break/gum up.

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1 minute ago, Storm6436 said:

I'll apologize for dropping a comment without having read page 2 yet... and I'll apologize again for dropping a comment and poofing, but seeing as my time until finals next week is at a premium... *shakes fist at the Physics Gods ... and the chair of the Physics Dept*

 

 When you do get the gunsmith profession working, are you planning on allowing wheel/breach guns to jam?    Admittedly, revolvers jam *far* less frequently than semi-autos but it's been my experience that when revolvers finally get around to jamming, they're best used as clubs until you can take it to a smith (or take it apart yourself... which is *fun* if you don't have the right tools.)   

Can't speak for breechloaders though, I've neither owned own nor heard from any of my friends who have owned them about anything jam-related for them.  I figure mechanical failure is mechanical failure, and just as the mechanical timing and all the little fun stuff in revolvers loves to hate you, I figure breechloaders should be subject to the same rules of "How bad does the Universe hate you today?" with admittedly even smaller chances due to fewer parts to break/gum up.

 

Well specifically, the current jam implantation is a 'failure to feed' jam.  Its triggered when the next round is feeding into the chamber which is why its excluded from rotary actions and breach.  It doesn't account for actual mechanical failures, or bullets stuck in barrels.  I'd like to include other random failures and mishaps as well (like for that unlucky person who makes the mistake of cleaning a loaded gun)...but that's all going to have to wait for now I'm giving the new weapon attachment system priority.

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So... before I get into possibly offering the handling of the steam workshop side of things for the community, unless you have found someone else already....

 

 

Our server currently uses the ORGM mod found on steam. 

 

Will this be a simple replacement, like changing the mod info on our server and then its just good to go?

In ORGM, pressing the num 1 key has the strange effect of spawning all the guns into the players inventory. This has been "kinda fixed" by installing the ORGM override.  Is this needed with this version as well?

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18 minutes ago, FinestHops said:

So... before I get into possibly offering the handling of the steam workshop side of things for the community, unless you have found someone else already....

Khaos is going to be handling the steam uploads, the original ORGM workshop item will be updated  so there shouldn't be any need to edit the servers mod info.  There's some time being given before the upload though so people can prepare for the change. Save files and such are not compatible with the new version, servers will need map resets, any player trying to use a gun spawned from the original mod will run into errors.

 

No need for the override, the cheat spawn key has been removed.

 

Edit: I should mention any ORGM compatibility mods or addons (such as the ORGM Suppressors mod) aren't expected to work with the new version either, too many things have changed.

Edited by Fenris_Wolf

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When is this update going to roll out then because we run an RP server so we can not just reset the map or player saves. If it will become that extensive then we will have to drop ORGM entirely until the next lore which is months away. If this is the case, if we dont drop ORGM enitrely, we will have to upload our own legacy version and link to that and hope that works. 

Edited by FinestHops

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awesome. We would for sure need that legacy version. The update itself sounds awesome and I know we will swap over eventually, we just cant at this time for the mentioned reasons. 

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We're having some issues getting it to upload. Khaos is working on it. Hey FW, I have a load of icons for all the guns, ammo and mags I had been planning. You want them?

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Just now, ORMtnMan said:

Hey FW, I have a load of icons for all the guns, ammo and mags I had been planning. You want them?

Sure, if its the ones that were in the 'in-development' branch on the github page, I have those.  But if you got more then of course! The more the better ^_^

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Ok.... PLEASE upload a legacy version first and give a little notice as to when its up so those of us that dont want their saves broken can change over before the other version updates.

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6 hours ago, FinestHops said:

Ok.... PLEASE upload a legacy version first and give a little notice as to when its up so those of us that dont want their saves broken can change over before the other version updates.

 

It's alright man, the Legacy version has been uploaded: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1222411135

 

I wasn't going to update it until the legacy version was established. Please do give that a try and let me know if it works. If it does I will proceed with trying to update the original.

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