RELEASED: Vehicle Test 23
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Yeah, as someone said, skill need more detailing. Not like "everything drown in details" but a little depth.

Carpentry - you can add skillbooks, without them player can't craft planks for example or other things ( same as Metalworking, that also unfinished as fuck )

First Aid - high LVL needed to heal deep wounds and pull out bullets/glass shards, apply splint RIGHT ( so bone will heal correctly ).

Electricial - Nuff said. Сompletely useless skill that need to be overhauled.

And etc..

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EG Bot   

#
# A fatal error has been detected by the Java Runtime Environment:
#
#  EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION (0xc0000005) at pc=0x00007ffc819496d5, pid=15928, tid=0x0000000000003be0
#
# JRE version: Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (8.0_121-b13) (build 1.8.0_121-b13)
# Java VM: Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (25.121-b13 mixed mode windows-amd64 compressed oops)
# Problematic frame:
# C  [PZBullet64.dll+0x96d5]

 

There's the other subtle crash. No errors in the game's normal console.

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6 hours ago, DramaSetter said:

( same as Metalworking, that also unfinished as fuck )

 

I think we all recognise that there's stuff we need to revisit before 1.0 - but right now this is a thread for vehicles and the closest we'll get is patching up bodywork etc with the Metalwork skill. If you want to discuss other aspects of the game and how they can be improved, hopefully in a less dispiriting way,  then could you open up another thread? 

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I haven't completely followed the Cars build/branch but I think you guys are making it much more complicated than need be. Tire condition? Wheel friction? Low condition brakes? Come on! Cars should only serve two main purposes. One, to allow us to travel long distances and two, to allow us to carry lots of loot. I understand that you want more than just the basics like in the driving cars mod, which even though is very unpolished, it gets the job done. Enabling car physics and the possibility of different types, colors, capacities and speeds are good extras (actually the different varieties should be a given). Anything else is unneeded except for perhaps features that compliment the existing skills, e.g. metalworking - perhaps allowing us to armor the cars.  Also, from what I've seen so far, the newer builds (with all these extras) are causing some issues with the cars branch. You are just making it harder on yourself. I think you should just polish current car features and remove any outstanding bugs and move on to NPCs which I think will be a much more needed addition to the game. Perhaps make some kind of poll on what the current users want...

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11 minutes ago, PPanda0421 said:

I haven't completely followed the Cars build/branch but I think you guys are making it much more complicated than need be. Tire condition? Wheel friction? Low condition brakes? Come on! Cars should only serve two main purposes. One, to allow us to travel long distances and two, to allow us to carry lots of loot. I understand that you want more than just the basics like in the driving cars mod, which even though is very unpolished, it gets the job done. Enabling car physics and the possibility of different types, colors, capacities and speeds are good extras (actually the different varieties should be a given). Anything else is unneeded except for perhaps features that compliment the existing skills, e.g. metalworking - perhaps allowing us to armor the cars.  Also, from what I've seen so far, the newer builds (with all these extras) are causing some issues with the cars branch. You are just making it harder on yourself. I think you should just polish current car features and remove any outstanding bugs and move on to NPCs which I think will be a much more needed addition to the game. Perhaps make some kind of poll on what the current users want...

I can't help but agree, This is one of those times where simplicity is key. Like you said a poll would be a good idea.

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hey there,

i havent read all the pages but i'm guessing you know about the dissapearing cars after loading game single player.

also the car keys? - everytime i get in a car i get a key.  Take 5 or 6 trips in the same car - i have loads of keys. 

 

i am running in eazee car mode.

 

i cant seem to kill z's in my car unless i have a massive run-up - to build up speed.  In big trucks i dont think i have ever built up enough speed to kill anything.  so need a big stretch of road to get all mad-maxy.

thats more of an observation than an issue. 

 

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15 minutes ago, PPanda0421 said:

 Cars should only serve two main purposes. One, to allow us to travel long distances and two, to allow us to carry lots of loot.

 

I get your point, and we are simplifying stuff behind the scenes, but I also wanted to point out that we need to vary car quality in interesting ways, introduce different ways to kill / inconvenience the player with them etc - most of which will be invisible to characters who don't know what to look for. If you're not interested then this will all be hidden behind the Mechanic profession.

 

Finally it should be said that much of this isn't hugely complicated to code vs. the actual physics/implementation/art/engine stuff that's been going on for the past year or two for them. It's only been a matter of weeks that this top layer has had time on it. 

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Kuren   
32 minutes ago, Batsphinx said:

 

I get your point, and we are simplifying stuff behind the scenes, but I also wanted to point out that we need to vary car quality in interesting ways, introduce different ways to kill / inconvenience the player with them etc - most of which will be invisible to characters who don't know what to look for. If you're not interested then this will all be hidden behind the Mechanic profession.

 

Finally it should be said that much of this isn't hugely complicated to code vs. the actual physics/implementation/art/engine stuff that's been going on for the past year or two for them. It's only been a matter of weeks that this top layer has had time on it. 


Thank you :D So much this :) And also this: introduce different ways to kill / inconvenience the player :P

I (and many others) fully appreciate all the detail and complexity you all have put into PZ

Many <3s :)

Edit: Also, any update on this issue? It's been the one thing keeping me from testing more. Vehicles have made the game way more fun and brand new to me but it's hard to put in time when I can't load up a save at all for the duration of the build.

"i'm guessing you know about the dissapearing cars after loading game single player." - junglistjim
 

Edited by Kuren

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13 minutes ago, Kuren said:

Edit: Also, any update on this issue? It's been the one thing keeping me from testing more. Vehicles have made the game way more fun and brand new to me but it's hard to put in time when I can't load up a save at all for the duration of the build.

"i'm guessing you know about the dissapearing cars after loading game single player." - junglistjim

 

Yeah RJ thinks he's fixed for the next build - it was a save issue I think.

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3 hours ago, PPanda0421 said:

I think you guys are making it much more complicated than need be. Tire condition? Wheel friction? Low condition brakes? Come on! Cars should only serve two main purposes. One, to allow us to travel long distances and two, to allow us to carry lots of loot.

Uhm, just making cars carry tons of loot and go long distance without any draw backs is kinda OP. Tire condition and low air pressure causing low/high tire friction is a real world problem, and rusted out crappy brakes are quite a real world problem too. I don't see any issue in making the cars more interesting instead of them just adding in an op way to move a ton of loot to point A to B, sounds pretty boring/ a waste of potential cool additions. Hell I think it could use a bit more features in my opinion, integrating  metalworking, electrician and engineering skills in order to perform certain modification onto the vehicle. Sure the system needs a bit of a condensing by making tires switchable between all cars by the tires size instead of them only being for sedans, SUV, heavy duty ect. same with breaks and what not, go read Enigmas posts above for a better understanding  of what i mean. anyways I think its a good thing that they are fleshing this build out, pretty sure many people would be pretty disappointing if they just had crapped out a bunch of cars with nothing to do with them except drive and carry crap. More realistic is the perfect way to go, not over the top realistic, but what they've added so far is great, just needs a little tweeking with the car sub-types. And personally I want moar, like having to actually change oil, maybe have your engine lock up in winter and you'll need to grab a can of starter fluid or something, serpentine belt shreds up due to crappy alternator.

 

Lastly,  on a note of NPC's it would be best and less work for them if they hold off NPC's till the very LAST thing they do. the NPC's are going to have to interact with everything in there game environment, it would be a pain in the ass to say make NPC's now, then the go and add in something new and will have to go back into the NPC code and rig it up so they can interact with whatever new thing it may be.

 

Anyways looking forward to build 24 guys! hope to see it soon!

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Rogers   
11 hours ago, Svarog said:


Only thing in Common is Win 7. It's one bitch of a glitch.

I do have Service Pack 1 for windows 7.

Note: Sometimes PZBullet crashes the game for me. I'll try to screencap the console next time it happens because it doesn't save, it's a full java crash that doesn't go into console. Related? Anyone getting a complete crash where PZBullet appears in the console?

I also have Service Pack 1 for windows 7. So, we have that in common.
 

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10 hours ago, Batsphinx said:

 

I get your point, and we are simplifying stuff behind the scenes, but I also wanted to point out that we need to vary car quality in interesting ways, introduce different ways to kill / inconvenience the player with them etc - most of which will be invisible to characters who don't know what to look for. If you're not interested then this will all be hidden behind the Mechanic profession.

 

Finally it should be said that much of this isn't hugely complicated to code vs. the actual physics/implementation/art/engine stuff that's been going on for the past year or two for them. It's only been a matter of weeks that this top layer has had time on it. 

Having different types of cars is a given/required for this type of feature so I'm glad we have different types. I hope that at the least someone can be able to start the car (obviously if the key is there), put gas in it and use it even if they have level 0 mechanic.

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7 hours ago, Man_In_The_Purple_Hat said:

Uhm, just making cars carry tons of loot and go long distance without any draw backs is kinda OP. Tire condition and low air pressure causing low/high tire friction is a real world problem, and rusted out crappy brakes are quite a real world problem too. I don't see any issue in making the cars more interesting instead of them just adding in an op way to move a ton of loot to point A to B, sounds pretty boring/ a waste of potential cool additions. Hell I think it could use a bit more features in my opinion, integrating  metalworking, electrician and engineering skills in order to perform certain modification onto the vehicle. Sure the system needs a bit of a condensing by making tires switchable between all cars by the tires size instead of them only being for sedans, SUV, heavy duty ect. same with breaks and what not, go read Enigmas posts above for a better understanding  of what i mean. anyways I think its a good thing that they are fleshing this build out, pretty sure many people would be pretty disappointing if they just had crapped out a bunch of cars with nothing to do with them except drive and carry crap. More realistic is the perfect way to go, not over the top realistic, but what they've added so far is great, just needs a little tweeking with the car sub-types. And personally I want moar, like having to actually change oil, maybe have your engine lock up in winter and you'll need to grab a can of starter fluid or something, serpentine belt shreds up due to crappy alternator.

 

Lastly,  on a note of NPC's it would be best and less work for them if they hold off NPC's till the very LAST thing they do. the NPC's are going to have to interact with everything in there game environment, it would be a pain in the ass to say make NPC's now, then the go and add in something new and will have to go back into the NPC code and rig it up so they can interact with whatever new thing it may be.

 

Anyways looking forward to build 24 guys! hope to see it soon!

AKAIK they already allow cars to carry tons of loot, I think the capacity is around 200, probably different with larger/smaller cars. So if you think that is OP then let them know. Yes I already mentioned enabling physics and different car varieties is a good feature. You might be a car enthusiast but some of us aren't. We might not want any new car features. How many of us have the same thoughts, I don't know. Which is why I suggested doing a poll.

 

You want more features? I can list a crap ton of features with cars (some might already be in game):

1. Winter is in the game right? Lets have winter, summer and all year round tires. Different tires work differently depending on the terrain and month.

2. Tires get worn out. We should have to rotate tires every few months or x miles.

3. In winter there should be ice on the road. Cars should slip and slide on ice.

4. When it rains cars should also slip and slide.

5. When slipping and sliding the way you turn controls how your car slides. Pressing the brakes should also lock up the brakes.

6. There are different types of ice, slush, compacted or black ice. Each type should have different effects on driving

7. Cars should have odometer readings. A car has lots of mileage should require maintenance more often and have more issues. A brand new car (0 mileage) should be able to run a long time without any issues.

8. We need to fill/refill windshield wiper fluid, antifreeze, brake fluid, etc every so often.

9. Need to change car batteries every so often.

10. If player leaves headlights on all night, car battery gets drained and car needs to be jump started to work.

11. Car batteries capacity should be vary.

12. Driving into objects should no only damage the car but also the object. E.g. streetlights, houses, benches, walls, doors, etc.

13. A car should light on fire if you through a molotov at it or if fire spreads to it.

14. A car should take damage only at a certain spot if you fire at it with a firearm. Same with melee weapons.

15. Damage caused by an axe should be noticeable while damage by a knife should only leave small dents.

16. Damage to a tire caused by melee weapons should pop that tire.

17. Cars can be taken apart so that we can upgrade/maintain another car.

18. Zombie bodies (on the ground) should inhibit or at least slow down driving.

19. Running over bodies or hitting zombies should make the car bloody.

20. Driving on dirt should make cars dirty.

21. Driving on dirt when it rains should make car tires muddy.

22. Muddy car tires should leave muddy tracks on the road.

23. Rain should wash away muddy tracks.

24. If you don't wear seatbelts and you're driving really fast and suddenly hit an object, you get thrown from the car.

25. Zombies can break windows in cars and attack you through broken windows.

26. Cars can be rienforced with wood planks or metal sheets later on.

 

I'm not a mechanic and these are some of the ideas I can think of. Imagine what a real mechanic can add to make it more realistic. We can make the cars feature as realistic as real life. Should we? No. My point is that we should not turn this into a driving simulator with zombies.

 

I hope they also took into consideration spawning/availability of items related to cars.

 

Not sure what you mean by pain in the ass to make NPCs now. They already have a branch for separate features like cars, why not have a branch for NPCs? My suggestion was to finish up cars and make a new branch for NPCs to at least start working on it. I don't know if you've been to the steam forums but a lot of people ask 'Where are animations/NPCs' more often than 'Where are cars?'

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Octopus   
38 minutes ago, PPanda0421 said:

AKAIK they already allow cars to carry tons of loot, I think the capacity is around 200, probably different with larger/smaller cars. So if you think that is OP then let them know. Yes I already mentioned enabling physics and different car varieties is a good feature. You might be a car enthusiast but some of us aren't. We might not want any new car features. How many of us have the same thoughts, I don't know. Which is why I suggested doing a poll.

 

You want more features? I can list a crap ton of features with cars (some might already be in game):

1. Winter is in the game right? Lets have winter, summer and all year round tires. Different tires work differently depending on the terrain and month.

2. Tires get worn out. We should have to rotate tires every few months or x miles.

3. In winter there should be ice on the road. Cars should slip and slide on ice.

4. When it rains cars should also slip and slide.

5. When slipping and sliding the way you turn controls how your car slides. Pressing the brakes should also lock up the brakes.

6. There are different types of ice, slush, compacted or black ice. Each type should have different effects on driving

7. Cars should have odometer readings. A car has lots of mileage should require maintenance more often and have more issues. A brand new car (0 mileage) should be able to run a long time without any issues.

8. We need to fill/refill windshield wiper fluid, antifreeze, brake fluid, etc every so often.

9. Need to change car batteries every so often.

10. If player leaves headlights on all night, car battery gets drained and car needs to be jump started to work.

11. Car batteries capacity should be vary.

12. Driving into objects should no only damage the car but also the object. E.g. streetlights, houses, benches, walls, doors, etc.

13. A car should light on fire if you through a molotov at it or if fire spreads to it.

14. A car should take damage only at a certain spot if you fire at it with a firearm. Same with melee weapons.

15. Damage caused by an axe should be noticeable while damage by a knife should only leave small dents.

16. Damage to a tire caused by melee weapons should pop that tire.

17. Cars can be taken apart so that we can upgrade/maintain another car.

18. Zombie bodies (on the ground) should inhibit or at least slow down driving.

19. Running over bodies or hitting zombies should make the car bloody.

20. Driving on dirt should make cars dirty.

21. Driving on dirt when it rains should make car tires muddy.

22. Muddy car tires should leave muddy tracks on the road.

23. Rain should wash away muddy tracks.

24. If you don't wear seatbelts and you're driving really fast and suddenly hit an object, you get thrown from the car.

25. Zombies can break windows in cars and attack you through broken windows.

26. Cars can be rienforced with wood planks or metal sheets later on.

All of those ideas sound awesome, and in a poll I would vote "hell yes" for every single one of them.

Edited by Octopus
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9 minutes ago, Octopus said:

All of those ideas sound awesome, and in a poll I would vote "hell yes" for every single one of them.

Expect cars to be released summer 2018 if they implement all that. Either you're trolling or didn't understand my post. Let me make things clear. My list (of suggestions) was to show that we can always take things too far. The poll is to decide what we the current users think should be on their priority list.

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Octopus   
27 minutes ago, PPanda0421 said:

Expect cars to be released summer 2018 if they implement all that. Either you're trolling or didn't understand my post. Let me make things clear. My list (of suggestions) was to show that we can always take things too far. The poll is to decide what we the current users think should be on their priority list.

I understood your post perfectly. I also understand that we have very different ideas about what constitutes "taking things too far", as you put it. What you see as overly complicated, I see as an interesting challenge.

 

Also, I am perfectly comfortable waiting until 2018 if it means giving the developers time to do things right. It's what I've been doing for six years (I first bought this game in late 2011), and I feel we've been getting one hell of a game because of the developers have been given the time to do things right. If you want a rushed half-assed zombie game, there are plenty on the market to choose from.

Edited by Octopus
grammer

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OffitMan   
52 minutes ago, Octopus said:

If you want a rushed half-assed zombie game, there are plenty on the market to choose from.

 

This guy gets it! ;-)

 

Plus, most of those suggestions did sound pretty cool.  The odometer would be awesome, just to see how far you'd traversed in your car. The battery going flat after leaving your lights on all night. Anything to do with the car getting dirty and rain washing it, I'm down with all that. My suggestion, it'd be awesome if your car wouldn't start, a group in multiplayer (or once NPCs are back) could push start it. Could lead to some tense situations.

 

For me, its the little details that make the difference between a good game and a great game. When a game tells little stories through its mechanics and systems interacting with one another, rather than strictly relying on a narrative or a plot, I always appreciate it more.

 

14 hours ago, PPanda0421 said:

Perhaps make some kind of poll on what the current users want...

 

Or just let TIS make the game they want?

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1 hour ago, Octopus said:

I understood your post perfectly. I also understand that we have very different ideas about what constitutes "taking things too far", as you put it. What you see as overly complicated, I see as an interesting challenge.

 

Also, I am perfectly comfortable waiting until 2018 if it means giving the developers time to do things right. It's what I've been doing for six years (I first bought this game in late 2011), and I feel we've been getting one hell of a game because of the developers have been given the time to do things right. If you want a rushed half-assed zombie game, there are plenty on the market to choose from.

Ok, I understand now. You want cars to be so feature rich so that you can enjoy the game more with the challenges it will provide. I on the other hand see it as a side feature, something that is nice to have but not required, unless you plan to travel to other cities. I guess I'll be in the group that will have 0 mechanical level and just fuel the car and drive it when necessary. If the car breaks down I'll find another car. So you are right we do have different ideas about this new feature. What if the developers decide to add all the features I mentioned and also add a ton more features to cars. But here's the thing, what if they can't get everything working until winter 2018? Spring 2019? Summer 2019? Surely your patience must have a limit. I am sure most of us do. Given unlimited time game developers can do anything. The question is will the fans stick around until then.

 

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18 hours ago, Batsphinx said:

 

I think we all recognise that there's stuff we need to revisit before 1.0 - but right now this is a thread for vehicles and the closest we'll get is patching up bodywork etc with the Metalwork skill. If you want to discuss other aspects of the game and how they can be improved, hopefully in a less dispiriting way,  then could you open up another thread? 

Sorry if that message was offensive to you/your team, sometimes i can be too rude and choose wrong words.

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Quite some of your suggestions are planned/already in PPanda ;)

 

Goal is quite basic: have something for people who doesn't care about vehicle but still want to use it. Basically, find one with key, refuel it, change tire if you want (require level 0 mechanic), then drive i. You crashed? Car's dead? Time to find another one, no need to repair!

And also for people who wants to spend time with their car, trying to find better parts for it, customize it (you like truck for their trunk size but they're too heavy/loud? invest in mechanic to reduce this!), be a mechanic in a MP group, repairing cars... You found a sport car in good shape but the suspension are worn out, find some performance suspension and mount them.

 

 

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Hi,

another observation on cars:

Brakes - they just dont seem to be needed half the time. 

as soon as you stop pressing forward the cars come to a complete stop very quickly.

I think it would be a bit more realistic if cars coasted more - so you actually had to use the brakes.  the brakes would need to be increased in power as they dont slow you down very much.

 

cornering - i like the skid noise - would be awesome if the cars would slide - back end slide out if turning on wet or non road surface.

 

i just feel cars are way too safe and should have more danger - crash and BURN baby.

 

could be cos im on the easy mode for cars tho.

 

finally love the way every time i start the game the number of red errors keeps dropping - was 6 then 5 now 3.

good job on fixing dem bugs - keep it up

tanks - oo typo i meant thanks or did i..........

 

 

tanks

 

 

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umagaar   
9 hours ago, Ceadda said:

When I load previousvehicle I get build vehicle test 22. How do I get back to vehicle test 21 since i have a lot of time invested in that save?

I've also been asking this question on this thread, on my own separate thread in the support section, on the subreddit and on the official discord server, but I have gotten no reply anywhere. Is it possible to get a response on this?

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