Punishment for Dying
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Right now, death has no real consequence. People will kill themselves just to get rid a broken leg. One change that could give people more a reason to not die, is giving people less skill points each time they die. The first character (the one made when creating a world) should have the default amount of 8 skill points. After a player dies, the next character they create in this game should have 6 points. The next after that should have 4 points. Each character should have 2 less points than the one before. This should cap off at -10 skill points. This would give players a very good reason to try to survive whatever is thrown at them and to keep pushing on, rather than just looking for some bleach because they fell off of the second floor.

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33 minutes ago, dannyisdude said:

Right now, death has no real consequence. People will kill themselves just to get rid a broken leg. One change that could give people more a reason to not die, is giving people less skill points each time they die. The first character (the one made when creating a world) should have the default amount of 8 skill points. After a player dies, the next character they create in this game should have 6 points. The next after that should have 4 points. Each character should have 2 less points than the one before. This should cap off at -10 skill points. This would give players a very good reason to try to survive whatever is thrown at them and to keep pushing on, rather than just looking for some bleach because they fell off of the second floor.

 

The reason to not die is just not dying and probably losing the world.

 

Unless you are talking about MP and thats a whole new monster that no matter what you do, its never going to work and please the community.

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This might be a good idea, with skill points resetting back to the default when either the player starts a new game (in singleplayer) or makes a new name (in multiplayer).

Of course, doing so would mean losing everything you have earned so far, except in multiplayer where you can go back to your corpse to loot the stuff, but it is going to be open for any scavengers to loot. (Including the safehouse.)

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9 minutes ago, PZ Mania said:

This might be a good idea, with skill points resetting back to the default when either the player starts a new game (in singleplayer) or makes a new name (in multiplayer).

Of course, doing so would mean losing everything you have earned so far, except in multiplayer where you can go back to your corpse to loot the stuff, but it is going to be open for any scavengers to loot. (Including the safehouse.)

 

Wait what.

 

Skill points reset after death since well, your character is ded.

 

IF you continue your world after you die, you continue with a new character, as far as i know you cant have your skill points back in a new character since he is new.

 

Same thing in MP, dying in MP means you lose all the hard work you did in a character and having to start over and the lack of supplies that you had.

 

Like what else there is to punish? You lose your skills, probably a good portion of your loot that you carried and probably your safehouse in MP if it has PVP on.

 

Also that makes me think, how many people use the feature of spawning in your old save with a new character? I never tried it because i dont see a reason to do so.

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Yeah, unless something changed and I didn't notice, dying and restarting in the same world with a new character means you lost all your character skills that you acquired like carpentry, sprinting, sneaking, cooking etc.

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10 hours ago, Blasted_Taco said:

Wait what.

 

Skill points reset after death since well, your character is ded.

 

IF you continue your world after you die, you continue with a new character, as far as i know you cant have your skill points back in a new character since he is new.

 

4 hours ago, blindcoder said:

Yeah, unless something changed and I didn't notice, dying and restarting in the same world with a new character means you lost all your character skills that you acquired like carpentry, sprinting, sneaking, cooking etc.

 

I think the OT is talking about the trait points, which I said skill points too by accident. The trait points you get to spend during character creation on positive (spending) and negative (gaining) traits.

If I am not mistaken, taking the unemployed profession gives the default trait points of 8. So according to the OT, the punishment for dying would mean you would have 2 less trait points to spend on after every death. The cap of -10 would mean you would need to choose negative traits equivalent of 10 to even start the game.

 

Unless I have understood it wrong, then I am terribly sorry.

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1 hour ago, PZ Mania said:

 

I think the OT is talking about the trait points, which I said skill points too by accident. The trait points you get to spend during character creation on positive (spending) and negative (gaining) traits.

If I am not mistaken, taking the unemployed profession gives the default trait points of 8. So according to the OT, the punishment for dying would mean you would have 2 less trait points to spend on after every death. The cap of -10 would mean you would need to choose negative traits equivalent of 10 to even start the game.

 

Unless I have understood it wrong, then I am terribly sorry.

 

That is what i am guessing too.

The point still stands, why would you punish a new character when the old character dies?

 

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1 hour ago, PZ Mania said:

 

 

 

I think the OT is talking about the trait points, which I said skill points too by accident. The trait points you get to spend during character creation on positive (spending) and negative (gaining) traits.

If I am not mistaken, taking the unemployed profession gives the default trait points of 8. So according to the OT, the punishment for dying would mean you would have 2 less trait points to spend on after every death. The cap of -10 would mean you would need to choose negative traits equivalent of 10 to even start the game.

 

Unless I have understood it wrong, then I am terribly sorry.

Whoops, I meant trait points. And you understood me perfectly.

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44 minutes ago, Blasted_Taco said:

That is what i am guessing too.

The point still stands, why would you punish a new character when the old character dies?

 

Like the OT said, dying really doesn't give much penalties except losing all the skill points. Of course it is going to affect you a lot late game when you have leveled up a lot of skills. But you can still have a lot of fun without actually leveling the skills. A lot of people (especially in multiplayer) simply suicide just because they don't want to wait the time for their fractured leg to recover. They die because they are too far away from their safehouse and are lazy to head back. They die because they simply don't like their hairstyle.

 

I am not sure how giving a trait point penalty will work out, but I don't think it is a bad idea to give more penalties. Such as losing the claims over your safehouse in multiplayer. In the server I play on, you need to survive 7 days to claim a safehouse, but if you died and make a new character, as long as you already had a safehouse before you died, you will still be the owner. Maybe give penalty of losing the claims to your safehouse when your character dies? Then you will have to survive 7 more days to claim it back, and until then its for anyone else to come and raid.

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8 minutes ago, PZ Mania said:

 

Like the OT said, dying really doesn't give much penalties except losing all the skill points. Of course it is going to affect you a lot late game when you have leveled up a lot of skills. But you can still have a lot of fun without actually leveling the skills. A lot of people (especially in multiplayer) simply suicide just because they don't want to wait the time for their fractured leg to recover. They die because they are too far away from their safehouse and are lazy to head back. They die because they simply don't like their hairstyle.

 

Here is why they die: They have backups.

 

Adding this suggestion wont stop people from dying for one single thing, they can go back to the same character with the same skills/tratis and levels because they backed up their saves.

 

I have played with legit players in MP and i never EVER seen someone kill off their character when they break a leg, simply because they grinded like a motherfucker the carpentry levels, they will walk 20 minutes to get back to base and stay inside the most time possible till they can move again.

 

However the players you and danny are thinking off are the ones in big popular servers, example of Zeeks and Redboid where i had most experience with. They always have backup characters, if they get bit, time to roll back to the back up, broke a leg? Roll back, we are getting raided by players? let my roll back to my character.

 

And there is nothing you can do to stop them, putting penalties for dying means that legit players get shit on while the players that might die but they have a back up will never suffer from it.

In SP there is nor reason to have a penalty since your death, as i said above, makes it so you lose everything and if you continue in your world, where that is on you and you alone, but with a new character.

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10 minutes ago, Blasted_Taco said:

 

Here is why they die: They have backups.

 

Adding this suggestion wont stop people from dying for one single thing, they can go back to the same character with the same skills/tratis and levels because they backed up their saves.

 

I have played with legit players in MP and i never EVER seen someone kill off their character when they break a leg, simply because they grinded like a motherfucker the carpentry levels, they will walk 20 minutes to get back to base and stay inside the most time possible till they can move again.

 

However the players you and danny are thinking off are the ones in big popular servers, example of Zeeks and Redboid where i had most experience with. They always have backup characters, if they get bit, time to roll back to the back up, broke a leg? Roll back, we are getting raided by players? let my roll back to my character.

 

And there is nothing you can do to stop them, putting penalties for dying means that legit players get shit on while the players that might die but they have a back up will never suffer from it.

In SP there is nor reason to have a penalty since your death, as i said above, makes it so you lose everything and if you continue in your world, where that is on you and you alone, but with a new character.

 

Yeah savescumming is a huge problem in multiplayer.

That being said legit people absolutely suicide with broken legs. I know because i used to do this unless the character was very high level, because i knew i could lvl up again in less than the 6 or so hrs i had to have a broken leg. Now i make sure i lvl up first aid, so i don't have to wait as long. Anyways, if you are not high level then there are for sure times it is wise to suicide.

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exactly, savescummers :/ they kinda ruin the fun.

there are also players that just charge for the best loot with a completely untrained test dumm- i mean character- so that they don't have to care about it dying, they'll just drop the bags and pick the loot back up.

there are times when this can be useful, but most of the times it just ruins it for everybody. why would i grind seriously (i hate grinding) when someone else is just going to use expendable characters and clean up the map while i'm stuck levelling?

 

i have no clue on how to fix savescum and this other kind of players, but i definitely think this needs some changes, i can't even have fun on the biggest servers because of this

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8 hours ago, Blasted_Taco said:

Here is why they die: They have backups.

 

Adding this suggestion wont stop people from dying for one single thing, they can go back to the same character with the same skills/tratis and levels because they backed up their saves.

 

I have played with legit players in MP and i never EVER seen someone kill off their character when they break a leg, simply because they grinded like a motherfucker the carpentry levels, they will walk 20 minutes to get back to base and stay inside the most time possible till they can move again.

 

However the players you and danny are thinking off are the ones in big popular servers, example of Zeeks and Redboid where i had most experience with. They always have backup characters, if they get bit, time to roll back to the back up, broke a leg? Roll back, we are getting raided by players? let my roll back to my character.

 

And there is nothing you can do to stop them, putting penalties for dying means that legit players get shit on while the players that might die but they have a back up will never suffer from it.

In SP there is nor reason to have a penalty since your death, as i said above, makes it so you lose everything and if you continue in your world, where that is on you and you alone, but with a new character.

 

I know savescummers are a huge problem but that isn't what we are talking about. If they are going to savescum they are going to do it anyways whatever changes.

This suggestion is mostly for people who actually want to have that penalty to actually care about their character. Sometimes when you play games like these, you get to have affection for your character and having a penalty makes you want to keep living with it even more.

 

But yes, I understand a lot of people would rather have advantages than disadvantages, so it could be a sandbox option/server option.

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16 hours ago, Unghin said:

Good idea if you are continue in same world.  But no way for new worlds.

 

Yes, this isn't a good idea for new worlds. The point of a new world is to start from scratch. The penalty is just there so you don't die to get an easy way to continue whatever you were doing.

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IMO there is no real good way to do this that couldn't be used against players who do play by the "hidden etiquette".

 

If you are playing single player I'm sure people offing themselves for better starts aren't in it for the bragging rights, as it's single player. However for multiplayer there is a crap ton of variables to think of here.

 

Is there a degree of metagaming included purposely for the sake of community challenges? Is this server for purposely easy experimentation? Is the player losing a lot by dying (or not enough)?

 

I can see this being a good optional where the admin decided what degree this is included to, but I'd advise against making this forced or even default for that matter.

Edited by Kim Jong Un

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How about punishing death with time? Making gaps between characters' lives, that would affect food, fort conditions, zombies etc.

 

Thoughts?

Edited by Keshash
because

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50 minutes ago, Keshash said:

How about punishing death with time? Making gaps between characters' lives, that would affect food, fort conditions, zombies etc.

 

Thoughts?

Interesting, but ultimately, I think it should still be up to the gamer in a single-player world to decide whether or not they deserve the luxury.

 

I think throwing a wait time between deaths, like a whole minute, and then two minutes, (and the counter resets after the server shuts down) is a good way to do it for multiplayer. So it's a pretty good idea in that regard. That way, people can't spam-die until they get the spawn location they want or something like that.

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17 hours ago, Kim Jong Un said:

I think throwing a wait time between deaths, like a whole minute, and then two minutes, (and the counter resets after the server shuts down) is a good way to do it for multiplayer. So it's a pretty good idea in that regard. That way, people can't spam-die until they get the spawn location they want or something like that.

I was faced with that. All players of SpiffoSpace Russia faced with that - admins provided such feature for short time. It made us suffering couse everytime you get ping or freeze and invisible zombies and you gonna die many times. Bad idea for people with not good connection and for unstable servers.

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3 hours ago, Unghin said:

I was faced with that. All players of SpiffoSpace Russia faced with that - admins provided such feature for short time. It made us suffering couse everytime you get ping or freeze and invisible zombies and you gonna die many times. Bad idea for people with not good connection and for unstable servers.

 

That's true, but I'm still confident it's the best motivator to not die if the wait times get severe enough after 'x' amount of deaths. Alas, it is probably best any form of this be optional for the server admin to decide.

 

The reason why I'm so against this being a single player option is because most people in SP naturally do the most they can to make the game easiest for their playstyle, I don't think they would give themselves this handicap if they planned on continuing the save. Advanced "ingame" time could be a feasible optional single player solution but there is not much of a way it could be implemented for multiplayer.

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