RELEASED: Build 34.10 - Food Tracker Build

[Zorak]

I hope i copied it from eight save folder

So I survived 22 days in survival, 90% was canned food and bag of chips + some fishes. I started with 95 kg and lost 10 kg in ~22 days.

Spoiler

averageCalories=-2800.0
caloriesMax=3560.488
caloriesMin=-3497.54

totalFedPercentage=0
totalStarvingPercentage=0
totalNormalHungerPercentage=100

totalExoPercentage=40
totalSleepPercentage=0
totalNormalPercentage=67

survivalTime=531.0046688980074

 

 

[akamber]

Just wanted to point out that cooking food is bad since it raises the hunger value restored but doesn't change the caloric intake.  Also, why cabbages are ~170 calories and strawberries are 1 calorie... I don't know.  In general, best to eat raw foods, maybe seasoned if you need the moodlet?

 

Finally, the 25% decrease women get in calories needed over men seems a bit over the top, who would ever play a male character now

 

Even eating constantly, my weight dropped and dropped, a stew made from steak, salmon, cabbage, etc. did nothing to the point I continued to watch my weight drop on the character screen.

 

Maybe cooking should make the food count as more calories, or maybe putting some foods together should increase their nutrition somehow?

 

In fact, growing most crops takes more energy then you get back by farming them.  Is this working as designed?

[Snorrsenkel]

Starving moodle does not decrease health, so is it possible to die on underweight with the new nutrition system?

Edited March 14, 2016 by Snorrsenkel

[Arturius]

I have a question to the Developers: when we can expect this version to be stable build, so it's available on GOG ?

 

Thanks !

[EnigmaGrey]

3 hours ago, Arturius said:

I have a question to the Developers: when we can expect this version to be stable build, so it's available on GOG ?

 

Thanks !

When it's ready.

[Arturius]

Thank you for this helpful answer and please remember about us GOG'ers.

 

[Rathlord]

19 minutes ago, Arturius said:

Thank you for this helpful answer and please remember about us GOG'ers.

 

 

To expand a bit more, as a rule we don't do ETAs. We'd rather get stuff where and how we want it to be without specific time constraints that may let people down if we don't meet it or force us to rush something un-fun out to try to meet it. We certainly haven't forgotten about GOG (we love GOG!) but "ready when it's finished" is the best answer we can give.

[sadpickle]

I'm playing a male with light eater trait and I already know I won't make it after the electricity cuts out. I've lost 1.21 kilos in almost 8 days. That time has been split between walking around the neighborhood gathering canned stuff and fighting zeds. I experienced a very slight uptick in weight (the first time) from eating a whole carton of ice cream. Vegetables won't cut it. A winter is going to do me in. Seeing as women get an (absurd) reduction in required calories, I won't be rolling male after this.

 

Most humans are very good at maintaining their body weight, the hunger feedback system is pretty good assuming normal health. I'm male, 30 years old and I've been 130lbs my whole adult life without tracking calories, ever. I don't need to eat like a maniac. Some days I eat little, some days I eat a lot. The hunger system needs to be tweaked; a light eater should be able to survive (maintain) on less calories, and a heavy eater should require more. I'd consider light eater a negative trait the way the mechanics are working. Activity should also tie in to caloric intake somehow. If I spend all day doing nothing with time on fast-forward, I should be able to maintain with less food intake.

[zomboid123]

1 hour ago, sadpickle said:

I'm playing a male with light eater trait [snip]

Yeah, I've been following your bug report. I'm wondering how many of the people complaining about their weight problems(in either direction) have taken these traits and how badly it could have affected base nutrition balance... Light eater really needs to make you burn less calories and hearty appetite needs to burn more, otherwise they are going to have the opposite effects on player behavior; Light eaters need to eat constantly to keep their weight up while taking hearty apetite requires you to starve yourself or suffer blowing up to marlon brando size.

[EnigmaGrey]

On 2016-02-12 at 9:45 AM, RobertJohnson said:

Oh crap, I forgot the tinopener thingy, damn, gonna fix that

 

There's no difference between men/women, because otherwise everyone would take woman as you need less calories

And it's already exponential, someone skinny loose less weight than someone obese.

Re: Women.

[EnigmaGrey]

37 minutes ago, zomboid123 said:

Yeah, I've been following your bug report. I'm wondering how many of the people complaining about their weight problems(in either direction) have taken these traits and how badly it could have affected base nutrition balance... Light eater really needs to make you burn less calories and hearty appetite needs to burn more, otherwise they are going to have the opposite effects on player behavior; Light eaters need to eat constantly to keep their weight up while taking hearty apetite requires you to starve yourself or suffer blowing up to marlon brando size.

Could be read two ways: light eaters might be naturally thin people due to their hunger easily being satisfied by small quantities of food. Alternatively, they may only need to eat small quantities of food to maintain your weight.

 

Likewise for hearty appetite.

[zomboid123]

15 minutes ago, EnigmaGrey said:

light eaters might be naturally thin people due to their hunger easily being satisfied by small quantities of food.

I get what you are saying, but the fact is those traits were balanced around the old hunger system and it shows.

EDIT: I think maybe it would be a good idea to just tie the hunger moodle into the new calorie system, it would not only fix these traits but would take the guesswork of calories. As it stands now it's kind of information overload... I'd considering myself a pretty hardcore PZ player and even I am overwhelmed. I am not even sure at this point what effect  carbs/protein/fats even have on my charactor... And was the whole "nutrients" thing scrapped? I remember lemmy saying he wanted veggies and vitamins to give nutrients.

Edited March 15, 2016 by zomboid123

[Snorrsenkel]

Im not having problems with the new system. It was kinda rethinking, but as soon as i kept focus on a steady daily calorie income it works just nice. 

 

Good nutrition may get too hard with daytime less than 1hr.

 

Maybe Its time for a official short tutorial on nutrition and also explain how fat, protein effects the survivor on the long term.

[akamber]

11 hours ago, EnigmaGrey said:

Re: Women.

I found this:

  private int caloriesToGainWeightMale = 1100;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxMale = 4000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightFemale = 1000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxFemale = 3000;

and there are different values for decreasing nutrition values for male and female.  Might not be exactly 25%, but they are less.

[EnigmaGrey]

41 minutes ago, akamber said:

I found this:

  private int caloriesToGainWeightMale = 1100;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxMale = 4000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightFemale = 1000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxFemale = 3000;

and there are different values for decreasing nutrition values for male and female.  Might not be exactly 25%, but they are less.

According to Romain they're unusued.

[EnigmaGrey]

8 hours ago, Snorrsenkel said:

Good nutrition may get too hard with daytime less than 1hr.

Yes, between nutrition and radios, I'd suggest 1 hour days for survival from this point forwrad.

[Snorrsenkel]

9 hours ago, akamber said:

I found this:

  private int caloriesToGainWeightMale = 1100;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxMale = 4000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightFemale = 1000;
  private int caloriesToGainWeightMaxFemale = 3000;

and there are different values for decreasing nutrition values for male and female.  Might not be exactly 25%, but they are less.

The value "averageCalories" (nutritiondebug.txt) controls your weight, not a certain calorie income.
This value is affected by the fed/hunger moodles, and exertion.
So if you want to keep your weight, just try to avoid activating theese moodles and PZ with Food Tracker will become smooth sailing.

[zomboid123]

6 minutes ago, Snorrsenkel said:

The value "averageCalories" (nutritiondebug.txt) controls your weight, not a certain calorie income.
This value is affected by the fed/hunger moodles, and exertion.
So if you want to keep your weight, just try to avoid activating theese moodles and PZ with Food Tracker will become smooth sailing.

I'm pretty sure the fed/hunger moodles are just a fullness rating working off the "legacy" hunger system and the calories/weight are a seperate system. If fed/hunger affected your weight then hearty appetite/light eater wouldn't be exibiting the odd behavior they do... You can stay at hungry or lower eating the bare minimum to avoid the starvation moodle and still put on weight like crazy if you have hearty appetite.

[Snorrsenkel]

8 hours ago, zomboid123 said:

You can stay at hungry or lower eating the bare minimum to avoid the starvation moodle and still put on weight like crazy if you have hearty appetite.

Yes, in this case you simply have to activate the "fed" moodle a bit, until your "averageCalories" value will go back near 0.

This value will remain steady, until moodles get activated agin.
 

[Snorrsenkel]

All hunger moodles, from "peckish" will drag your "averageCalories" value down. Just stay in balance.

[Teesee]

Sorry to interrupt, I've already posted here about this with no further reactions. I'd like to know if these are known troubles or actual bugs so I know if I should post them in the tracker or not.

• With the nutritionist trait, using rice from a rice bag doesn't reduce the nutritional values of the bag (same calories, proteins... as when the bag was full). Is it linked to the fact it comes from a label, or an actual bug because nutritionnists should know the real values?
• Spices don't seem to be taken into account into recipes. Tested with mayonnaise: the recipe gives the same amount of calories (or other bonuses/maluses) with or without the addition of mayonnaise.
• Some items apparently lack their nutritional values. Seen with the nutritionist trait with Remoulade (screenshot)

[zomboid123]

I think they missed a few items, the remoulade you show and also the cheese sandwich found in bake shops has no nutrition.

[Jether]

Really starting to regret not paying attention in fitness wellness back in highschool. But this sort of depth to cooking is what i have been craving.

[Wolfihunter_prey]

I have a question, can wild eggs be used in recepies as a substitute for normal eggs? Also, how much information will the player see once this is released in the normal build, regarding calories and such? What traits would you need to see more info (if any)?

[nolanri]

I reloaded the 34.14 Classic PZ Items into the Item list. So now you can see the nutritional values for each item under the item attributes on the item page:

 

http://www.aggressivegaming.org/newdawn/wiki/itemlist.php?kind=Classic&type=Food