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On Horde Migration and Zombies post 32.


Qloos

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Post 32, I feel project zomboid is still too easy.  Yes, you heard me: easy.  I have collected my gear, moved out of town and created a safe house on, you guessed it: another roof.  After destroying the stairs I have survived off the endless substanence of rooftop cabbages and potatoes.

 

There are also alot more zombies.  Good.  Yet I feel they are still too stagnant, is it realistic and balanced they start centralized to city centers?  Of course!  Keep the players from looting the valuables from downtown I say.  On the other hand this creates the problem of predictability.  I want to play it safe?  I'll just skirt the downtown core.  I want hordes to be like the weather, one day I'll go outside without my umbrella and I'm going to get wet - or I'll be inside and forced to wait out the storm.

 

Refrence Image for suggestion

 

Nx3zU2X.png

 

Currently in Project Zomboid, each super grid has a set number of zombies that respawn at certain intervals.  I feel this is too predictable and easy to avoid.  I say, keep the current max number, abolish the respawns and instead have macro hordes that move from super grid to super grid on set conditions.

 

  • Each macro horde is a set number of zombies kept track of by only a few bits of information.  It's current grid, its number of zombies and current behavior.
  • If a macro horde passes over a grid that has less zombies than it's max, it will replenish that area.
  • Each game will have a set number of roaming hordes set at the start if it's a sandbox game and will generate more if a horde is depleted.
  • If two macro hordes meet they will combine.
  • Macro hordes will randomly set a destination and will travel one supergrid every day.
  • Macro hordes will abandon their set destinations if they detect distant signs of human life and will instead move to that location.

The weight of actions that attract a horde would have a value between 0 and 1 which reprensents the percentage chance that the attractant will cause the horde to move on that location.  Some actions that would act as attractants could be:

 

  • Gunfire (sound)
  • Cooking (smell)
  • Campfires (light source + smell)
  • Driving (when implemented)
  • Having rotting non zombie meat from trapping (smell)

These actions would have a falloff effect and their generated value would half for every grid away a macro horde is.  If wind direction was implemented it could be a 90:10 weighted ratio for falloff depending on the winds direction.

 

Once a horde has arrived, they do not leave.  They suspect a human is there and are going to hang around until they either get him or something else gets their attention.  It's time for the survivor to test his preparedness, does he have enough supplies to last a prolonged seige?  Does he have enough munitions and manpower to force an exit?  Does he have enough entertainment to keep the dangers of stress and paranoia at bay?  I would like to see situations like these.  Eventually, if the survivor inside is quiet enough and another survivor from somewhere else on the map creates an attractant of their own, the horde may migrate towards them instead and leave this survivor to escape.

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Although not disagreeing with the concept of the migrating horde, I think we need to look at some other factors first. After reading your post, my first impression is that maybe the problem is you don't have enough reason to take the risk to go on raids to more populated areas? If you're basically self-sustained, then yes, the game is going to become somewhat easy, and likely boring without any other threats, but if a player has been careful, smart, and even lucky to get to that point, I imagine it may be a little annoying for some to know that a horde is going to find you eventually, regardless of what they do.

 

Determining where there might be an issue may be more beneficial than immediately looking at the zombie migration - is it too easy to farm for instance, should you be able to "roof farm", or should you only be able to use planters/containers when growing on roof tops, which could limit your harvest amounts?

 

Just curious, is this survival you're playing? If so, what professions/traits have you been selecting? Is part of the problem that those areas still need balancing?

 

Anyway, like I said, I'm not against the ideas you've posted, I just think we need to look at other areas as well to make sure the problem can't be resolved by balancing other parts of the game. (Also, although a way off, additions like NPCs may well have a huge impact the game, and possibly situations like you've described)

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Although not disagreeing with the concept of the migrating horde, I think we need to look at some other factors first.

 

Agreed, here's my character setup.

 

Carpenter with: Slow Healer, Hemophobic, Feeble, Obese, Cats Eyes, Dextrous, Outdoorsman, Wakeful, Iron Gut, Brave, Lucky, Keen Hearing, Organized.

 

Survived for 1 Month 14 days with only 375 zombie kills, that's with going to town constantly to keep myself interested.  Only 100 of those were necessary at all.

 

Rooftop Nerf Suggestions:

 

  • Make wall vines climbable by zombies.  The bigger the roof base, the more time required on bush cleaning to prevent zombies climbing up.
  • Nerf roof farms
  • Increase the points required for Carpenter, being able to craft water crates before the water is shut off is a HUGE shortcut for survival.
  • Decrease the points given for Slow Healer and Hemophobic as these are cheesable skills if the player knows how not to get hurt.
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Although not disagreeing with the concept of the migrating horde, I think we need to look at some other factors first.

 

Agreed, here's my character setup.

 

Carpenter with: Slow Healer, Hemophobic, Feeble, Obese, Cats Eyes, Dextrous, Outdoorsman, Wakeful, Iron Gut, Brave, Lucky, Keen Hearing, Organized.

 

Survived for 1 Month 14 days with only 375 zombie kills, that's with going to town constantly to keep myself interested.  Only 100 of those were necessary at all.

 

Rooftop Nerf Suggestions:

 

  • Make wall vines climbable by zombies.  The bigger the roof base, the more time required on bush cleaning to prevent zombies climbing up.
  • Nerf roof farms
  • Increase the points required for Carpenter, being able to craft water crates before the water is shut off is a HUGE shortcut for survival.
  • Decrease the points given for Slow Healer and Hemophobic as these are cheesable skills if the player knows how not to get hurt.

 

dont make the zombies climb. they shouldn't even be able to hop fences but they do. And for some of us the difficulty is just fine.

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A sandbox option, then?

 

I just don't feel that there should be such a thing as an unassailable safe house.

There probably is a good argument to be made for nerfing or re-balancing certain traits, and activities, (like roof farming).

 

As far as the "unassailable safe house" - if you've managed to setup base in a good, solid building, knocked out the staircase etc, I don't have a problem with zombies not being able to get to you directly, but would definitely be good if other factors mean that you may be backing yourself into a corner - it'd be cool to be on the roof of your fortress, with food or water running low, and looking out at a zombie horde surrounding you and realising that once your supplies run out you're pretty much dead... :)

 

Maybe we need more penalties for boredom, depression, or health issues in a situation like that?

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A sandbox option, then?

 

I just don't feel that there should be such a thing as an unassailable safe house.

There probably is a good argument to be made for nerfing or re-balancing certain traits, and activities, (like roof farming).

 

As far as the "unassailable safe house" - if you've managed to setup base in a good, solid building, knocked out the staircase etc, I don't have a problem with zombies not being able to get to you directly, but would definitely be good if other factors mean that you may be backing yourself into a corner - it'd be cool to be on the roof of your fortress, with food or water running low, and looking out at a zombie horde surrounding you and realising that once your supplies run out you're pretty much dead... :)

 

Maybe we need more penalties for boredom, depression, or health issues in a situation like that?

 

i agree and support you completely.

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