Taboo Question

[Croak90]

*cough*

 

...so back in January/February devs said expect NPC update in late Q2 this year. Considering Q2 ends in a week and build 33 is probably going to focus on Steam-based MP, should we go ahead and kill the NPC hype?

[mads232]

I don't think it'll be in Q2 even though they said. I mean, they've had a lot going on atm. But it could be a great secret surprise

 

Following this topic anyways! Answer us devs!

 

Or don't! I like surprises..

[Croak90]

Wasn't actually asking if it's going to be in Q2, I think it's pretty obvious it won't be. I'm just asking if it'll be another multi-month delay or if it'll be coming with Build 33 or soon after.

 

Actually while I'm at it how're the vehicles coming?

Breaking all of the no ETA rules here...

[EnigmaGrey]

Oh, oh! Financial quarters! I'm prepared for this!

But no, it looks like the Q2 estimate will be missed. Good thing it wasn't an ETA, eh?

[LeoIvanov]

I'm actually more excited about the next week now that Q2 ends. It might (possibly) mean that we could, at the very least, get a video or two about the current state of what NPC's are in, or a few paragraphs about what new additions NPCs have gathered for the past several months since we've had the update on them.

 

I could seriously just sit down and watch a little NPC buddy run around and do stuff for 2 hours straight.. I mean, after all I did end up wasting half an hour of my time watching my zombified self wander around along with the horde that ate me... I don't know, maybe I'm just weird.

[mads232]

Wasn't actually asking if it's going to be in Q2, I think it's pretty obvious it won't be. I'm just asking if it'll be another multi-month delay or if it'll be coming with Build 33 or soon after.

 

Actually while I'm at it how're the vehicles coming?

Breaking all of the no ETA rules here...

I wasn't implying that you asked if it's coming in Q2. I was just saying my opinion on the ETA that was "promised"  

[RoboMat]

Has RJ already finished all his previous sit-ups? If not, I'm sure he'll be happy about this topic

[Svarog]

I'm actually more excited about the next week now that Q2 ends. It might (possibly) mean that we could, at the very least, get a video or two about the current state of what NPC's are in, or a few paragraphs about what new additions NPCs have gathered for the past several months since we've had the update on them.

 

I could seriously just sit down and watch a little NPC buddy run around and do stuff for 2 hours straight.. I mean, after all I did end up wasting half an hour of my time watching my zombified self wander around along with the horde that ate me... I don't know, maybe I'm just weird.

I remember an old NPC video TIS posted, I was like, Okay, cool, when is he going to bump into an NPC!?

Plot Twist! I was watching the NPC all along... I felt dumb, and that's awesome.

[Guest easy AI opponent]

I'm actually more excited about the next week now that Q2 ends. It might (possibly) mean that we could, at the very least, get a video or two about the current state of what NPC's are in, or a few paragraphs about what new additions NPCs have gathered for the past several months since we've had the update on them.

 

I also really think it is about time to give out a full blown out hands down ball to the wall mondoid about NCPs alongside with a new aim for the completion of 1.0.

[EnigmaGrey]

I'm actually more excited about the next week now that Q2 ends. It might (possibly) mean that we could, at the very least, get a video or two about the current state of what NPC's are in, or a few paragraphs about what new additions NPCs have gathered for the past several months since we've had the update on them.

 

I also really think it is about time to give out a full blown out hands down ball to the wall mondoid about NCPs alongside with a new aim for the completion of 1.0.

*Looks at title.* Someone has done my work for me.

 

Has RJ already finished all his previous sit-ups? If not, I'm sure he'll be happy about this topic 

Pole-dancing thread? I'll get @nasKo.

[Zorak]

TBH I try not to over-hype myself about NPCs. I play 90% MP and I dont see how AI can be better than other player. I hope that TIS will suprise me, but still Im looking forward more MP focused stuff like new map to visit, group system/UI and cars (+50 other smaller things).

[f3rret]

I'm stoked for the furniture moving stuff that we're (hopefully) getting in build 33. I don't care too much about NPCs, since I'm worried they're just going to try to steal my BBQs.

[explorator]

I have been looking forward to NPC's for a long time and I am eagerly anticipating their release.  I think NPC's are the last major piece that will really complete this game.

[f3rret]

I recently played a zombie game where the NPC interactions and dialog felt artificial, forced, and just bad. And they had been bragging about how much time and effort went into it, too... I'd much rather they take their time and do it properly.

[nasKo]

I'm actually more excited about the next week now that Q2 ends. It might (possibly) mean that we could, at the very least, get a video or two about the current state of what NPC's are in, or a few paragraphs about what new additions NPCs have gathered for the past several months since we've had the update on them.

I also really think it is about time to give out a full blown out hands down ball to the wall mondoid about NCPs alongside with a new aim for the completion of 1.0.

No, it's really not the time. If we would do that, it would be contra-productive and increase the ammount of people asking for them over the next weeks, if not months.

Q2 doesn't seem to be on the cards - neither calendrical nor financial quarter.

Our aim is still to get push out of Early Access this year, but you know how this goes. In the meantime, we'll continue to implement other features while work on the majors continues.

You might get a bit of a tease sooner or later, but don't expect us to give you the full-blown-out-hands-down-ball-I-am-not-sure-this-sentence-makes-sense-anymore-Mondoid you desire, soon.

Has RJ already finished all his previous sit-ups? If not, I'm sure he'll be happy about this topic

He's almost married. His time for sit-ups are soon to be over

should we go ahead and kill the NPC hype?

Good luck with that

[Guest easy AI opponent]

.

Q2 doesn't seem to be on the cards - neither calendrical nor financial quarter.

Our aim is still to get push out of Early Access this year, but you know how this goes. In the meantime, we'll continue to implement other features while work on the majors continues.

 

 

Its good to have aims but also in the time it was aimed for to finish 1.0 (until end of Q2) it was actually (only) accomplished to go from (i dont know) build 30 to 32.

In this context, is it at all realistic that 1.0 can be finished this year or will we have the same conversation in 6 months again (aka when this year ends)?

[nasKo]

Its good to have aims but also in the time it was aimed for to finish 1.0 (until end of Q2) it was actually (only) accomplished to go from (i dont know) build 30 to 32.

In this context, is it at all realistic that 1.0 can be finished this year or will we have the same conversation in 6 months again (aka when this year ends)?

It's still our aim. Time will tell, since I'm all out of magical crystal balls.

"From build 30 to 32" isn't really saying a lot, is it?

[Zorak]

.

Q2 doesn't seem to be on the cards - neither calendrical nor financial quarter.

Our aim is still to get push out of Early Access this year, but you know how this goes. In the meantime, we'll continue to implement other features while work on the majors continues.

Its good to have aims but also in the time it was aimed for to finish 1.0 (until end of Q2) it was actually (only) accomplished to go from (i dont know) build 30 to 32.

In this context, is it at all realistic that 1.0 can be finished this year or will we have the same conversation in 6 months again (aka when this year ends)?

If you look at map progress, last map update, what they aim for and how long it takes to create next chunk you can aim Q2 2016.

But its not a bad thing, we still get nice updates every 2 months so as far as we get steady updates im happy.

[Guest easy AI opponent]

It's still our aim. Time will tell, since I'm all out of magical crystal balls.

"From build 30 to 32" isn't really saying a lot, is it?

 

By itself not, but by comparing what’s left  to do for 1.0 and what already made it out in 31 and 32, it is.

[nasKo]

It's still our aim. Time will tell, since I'm all out of magical crystal balls.

"From build 30 to 32" isn't really saying a lot, is it?

 

By itself not, but by comparing what’s left  to do for 1.0 and what already made it out in 31 and 32, it is.

Aha.

Now we wait.

[lemmy101]

As long as it takes. Not soon. It sucks for everyone involved, devs included, but they will be held back until they are worthy of the wait, as they are extremely complex and could completely ruin the game if not just right. But more crucially people have waited a long time and that's a near impossible amount of expectation and anticipation to live up to. They need to be as good as possible on first release. With the new anim system coming in, it also means NPCs need to be tailored to the new combat / movement / stealth systems that come with that.

 

It's just going to take as long as it takes. But on the plus side, the longer it takes, the more PZ people will get for their money since more and more will be added to keep people as happy as possible until they are done.

 

Not the best news, but a silver lining. Trust me not a day goes by I don't stress about the NPCs and feel the burden of it hanging over us. We'd release if we thought it wouldn't disappoint people, break the game, and the NPCs objectively added to the experience. Sad fact is after such a long wait we can't release a 'WIP NPCs' and that cut it. People would be up in arms if they were broken after such a huge wait, and rightly so. Despite it being obvious a lot of work has gone into them as they stand, they are still short on the promises, and there are still hills on the horizon to climb (like the WIP stealth revamp) that will result in vastly better NPCs ultimately, but are non-the-less unavoidable roadblocks in the way.

 

We'll make being patient as easy as it is possible to do so, and have some super exciting stuff coming up (IMHO anyway) but it'll take as long as it takes, and this is for the good of the community, the game, and ourselves, even if its torturous for all in the meantime.

 

Make no mistake, our earlier predictions that multiplayer is more complex than AI were naive, at least the kind of AI we're aiming for. That's why NPCs have taken so long and MP kinda slipped in unexpectedly within a month.

 

There have been a few recently on the steam reviews calling into question our ethics over not having released NPCs yet and still being in Early Access. I'd make an argument that its our ethics that have stopped us releasing them. Where some others would bow to the (immense) pressure and add a 'bullet point ticker' substandard NPC system to fulfill their promises and deflect criticism, where we actually REMOVED an NPC system we deemed detrimental to the final game (admittedly it would have been a lot of extra work to get them working with the big map), and created a LOT (god only knows a LOT) of extra work for ourselves to make an NPC system worthy of our original promises, and no matter how angry people get we continue to flat out refuse to release anything substandard even if it means stretching the Early Access on and on and on.. and we really want out of Early Access.

 

We're suffering by those promises, as are you, but the end result will be better for us all and Zomboid will be a better game for it not only for the better NPCs but all the amazing features the other devs add in every update that may not have been implemented otherwise.

[f3rret]

^^^ I agree completely, don't rush it.

[mads232]

We're suffering by those promises, as are you, but the end result will be better for us all and Zomboid will be a better game for it not only for the better NPCs but all the amazing features the other devs add in every update that may not have been implemented otherwise.

That sentence breaks my heart. I really hope you keep developing the game after 1.0 as much as you're during right now.. Even though it kinda ruins the idea of "release" :/

[lemmy101]

 

We're suffering by those promises, as are you, but the end result will be better for us all and Zomboid will be a better game for it not only for the better NPCs but all the amazing features the other devs add in every update that may not have been implemented otherwise.

That sentence breaks my heart. I really hope you keep developing the game after 1.0 as much as you're during right now.. Even though it kinda ruins the idea of "release" :/

 

 

Don't get me wrong, we plan to support PZ long after 1.0. It's just not certain that any particular feature added would have been if it weren't for the elongated Early Access due to the delays in big features such as NPCs, map completion and Vehicles.

[Croak90]

We'd release if we thought it wouldn't disappoint people, break the game, and the NPCs objectively added to the experience. Sad fact is after such a long wait we can't release a 'WIP NPCs' and that cut it. People would be up in arms if they were broken after such a huge wait, and rightly so.

 

Just an idea. You guys could probably release a hush-hush version with NPCs in it to active/trustworthy community members that might help bring in testing results and sharpen the image of what needs to be refined, like the IWBUMS but more exclusive to prevent armed zombie uprisings. Granted you may already have more than enough info like that, in which case disregard.