Step and swing

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

Currently if you are being chased by zombies and you've got an axe, if you want to hit one you need to stop and turn around and swing, and then turn around and start running again. This just got my guy bitten and I got annoyed that it happened because you cannot step as you swing in this. Stepping actually adds power to swings.

 

Here's what you can do in reality: When running, stop with your right foot forwards and turn your body so that you are looking in the direction that was behind you before you stopped, so it can be said that without your feet moving your left foot is forwards. Now as you swing at the zombie move your left foot back and make your right foot be forwards, as you swing with power at the zombie's head. Now when you turn your body again it can be said that your left foot becomes the one in front of you because of where you are facing. Then put your right foot forth and alternate which one is forwards in a process called running. Done quickly you are seen to spin around in a circle as you run.

 

Here's another thing you can do in reality: If zombies approach you and you are facing them with your left foot is forwards, then step backwards with your left foot as you swing. Then with the next swing step backwards with your right foot. This way you are seen to be walking backwards, with each step being an opportinity to strike.

 

Here is another: When running, look behind you to see the persuer. Stop with your left foot forwards so that your body is turning to the right, and turn your upper body so that with the weapon in your right hand you may swing with power at the head of your persuer, and then turn around again in whichever direction feels right and continue running.

 

Here's how it works in the current project zomboid version: Stop running and turn around and swing and swing and swing and turn around and step and turn around and swing and turn around and run. You can walk backwards without swinging, but to swing you must be still.

 

My suggestion is that if you are pressing movement keys to move backwards as you swing or push zombies, your guy steps.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Gaffa Tape Warrior

[MrZombifiedGamer]

I don't think this is possible. I mean programming wise. Sounds complicated and I'm not even sure I understand what you're saying. xD

[Trojan_Turps]

I'm not sure what you are saying exactly but swinging an axe around like that would probably make you fall over or at least miss your target. You can step around swinging a sword with some training but then you are slashing not hacking. Swinging an axe with power while moving would end badly.

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

You might be able to understand what I said if you try it out yourself. The second example seems particularly easy.

 

Here is another attempt at description: Stand with your left foot forth with your weapon on your right shoulder, and step forwards with your right foot so that you approach your target and strike. If it is your right foot forwards, then have your weapon on your left shoulder, and strike as you step with your left foot. If your opponent is armed then it is good to step to the side.

 

Now for how to change which foot is forward without moving forwards. If your left foot is in front, then step in a triangle. What is stepping in a triangle? Each of your feet is a point of the triangle. A face of the triangle faces forwards where you are facing, and a corner of the triangle points backwards behind you. Your left foot is the front-left corner, and your right foot is the reatmost point. Step with your right foot so that it fills the empty front-right point, and step back with your left foot so that it is where your right foot was before.

 

Now for how to walk backwards. If your left foot is forwards then with your left foot step backwards. If your right foot is forwards then step backwards with it.

 

Now for another method of moving backwards whilst fighting. Step with both feet at once so that you spend some time above the ground like a boxer.

 

Here's how it could work in project zomboid: Holding down the attack button does not stop him from moving. Instead of standing still like a lemon he makes use of his feet.

In weapon martial arts the feet do not just stop when the hands start fighting. You can punch as you step, the stepping adding power to it. Instead of just letting the zombies surround him because he decided to fight them he can step or jump backwards. Currently the only thing for him to do is to stop fighting and turn around and run, which can also get him bitten.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Gaffa Tape Warrior

[Trojan_Turps]

Have you tried doing this with an axe while putting all your weigh in to the swings? If you haven't I would advise that you never do!

[Leoquent]

Currently if you are being chased by zombies and you've got an axe, if you want to hit one you need to stop and turn around and swing, and then turn around and start running again. [...]

 

"Zomboid Survival Guide #2 - Don't run

 

Survivors who run rapidly become survivors who are dead."

 

 

Let that running stuff be and simply hold down Ctrl while moving backwards. No need to turn around all the time...

 

Anyway thats how I'm doing it.

Step back, slash, repeat...

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

Have you tried doing this with an axe while putting all your weigh in to the swings? If you haven't I would advise that you never do!

No, I don't put all of my weight into swings, but in some situations it may be a good idea, if you were certain you could not possibly miss.

"Zomboid Survival Guide #2 - Don't run

 

Survivors who run rapidly become survivors who are dead."

 I think running is fine if your are travelling or fighting.

Let that running stuff be and simply hold down Ctrl while moving backwards. No need to turn around all the time...

 

Anyway thats how I'm doing it.

Step back, slash, repeat...

Yeah well this is one of the things I'm complaining about. Although you can hold down Ctrl while moving backwards, if you press the attack button he stands with his legs still on the spot, which is really not martially sound. I am suggesting that they make it so that he can move backwards or forwards or sideways as he attacks, like a real person can, and like I would want to in any armed fight really, particularly one against multiple opponents. This turning around thing was an example of a bit of reality, compared to Project Zomboid where you have to stand still whenever you attack.

Let's suppose zombies are approaching you from your front and left. I might step to the right, hitting the zombie in front of me. In project zomboid you would only be able to stand still as you swing at the zombie in front of you, and then the zombies to your left would be upon you. In that situation I might jump backwards, or do something to make them unhand me and my weapon while stepping backwards, or give him a bash while stepping backwards, or get their hands off as my body turns and then run. In project zomboid you have these two choices: Standing still and pushing some zombies backwards (attacking a few zombies at once), giving the others time to surround you ; and turning your back on them to run, but not in the same action getting their hands off you, risking bites.

You currently have to avoid situations that would in reality be survivable.

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

I am posting in this thread again because I still think this is a problem, and I've got a couple of anecdotes to add.
 
I was fighting two zombies with an axe. They were both in front of me. One was on my left, and one was on my right. I earlier had manoeuvred so that I was only facing one zombie, and the other was behind him, but in the time it took to bash one of them, the other had come around to me.
Here is one problematic effect of having to keep your feet still as you attack. Without any footwork, the zombies were able to get to fight me two against one.
So I was then fighting against two zombies. My two choices were turning around and running, and standing still and bashing. I chose bashing. I could not reposition myself, so I just had to hold down the attack buttons while aiming at the centre of the zombies. Eventually I got the bleeding moodle and clicked on the X.
Here is another problem. Once the zombies were fighting me two against one, I had no way to get out of it.

(I was originally fighting three zombies, but one was lying down from a blow to the head)
 
The other anecdote is when I was fighting seven zombies with a crowbar. I made it so that the faster zombie ran out in front of the rest so that I could bash him and only him. My two choices afterwards were turning around and running, and standing still and bashing. I chose turning around and running. Unfortunately, swinging and recovering made me stand still long enough for the rest of the zombies to travel several yards and start grabbing me. I got the bleeding moodle and clicked on the X.
The problem here again was that a requirement of bashing a zombie was standing still long enough for his friends nearby to give me a hug. It's not fair if the zombies can step and I can't.
 
I've read something about a combat overhaul that is being worked on, but it could be possible to implement a little fix in the meantime. Instead of locking movement on every fighting action, it could just be set to walking pace maximum. And then it would be possible to disable hitting multiple zombies with a single swing.

[Demonic_Kat]

Honestly I think the average joe would not be able to walk while swinging an axe full force and aiming for a Z's head. I know if personally I stepped forward while swinging I'd be off balance. If that strike were to miss I may throw the axe out of my hands lol. If I were stepping backwards while swinging I'd be liable to trip.

 

I think that, just like any other video game, combat is about timing. Combat in PZ will never emulate real life combat with swinging weapons, but you can practice at what the game is requiring you to do. E.g. swing, step, swing, run, swing, step, etc.

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

Honestly I think the average joe would not be able to walk while swinging an axe full force and aiming for a Z's head. I know if personally I stepped forward while swinging I'd be off balance. If that strike were to miss I may throw the axe out of my hands lol. If I were stepping backwards while swinging I'd be liable to trip.

 

I think that, just like any other video game, combat is about timing. Combat in PZ will never emulate real life combat with swinging weapons, but you can practice at what the game is requiring you to do. E.g. swing, step, swing, run, swing, step, etc.

Mister/Master/Miss/Missus average/not-average Joe/not-Joe, please try it out for yourself.

For the first lesson, stand somewhere and swing something in the air.

For the second lesson, take a step backwards as you swing.

 

I think your opinion probably comes from never having tried it yourself. Your opinion will be more valid if you actually try it yourself. It does not take years of martial training to be able to swing something while stepping and not lose the weapon.

I just went outside and did it. As I step backwards I feel my momentum and it is very easy to just continue turning around and run off in the opposite direction.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Gaffa Tape Warrior

[Trojan_Turps]

At the moment If they added the ability to swing a weapon and move they might as well remove zombies from the game. It would make combat against zombies too easy. Fighting PvP would also turn into people running around in circles (I imagine it might already be like that?) I'm sure something like what you are saying could be added but it would need to be done very carefully in order to not make it too OP.

[EnigmaGrey]

Third choice: back up and don't put yourself in such awkward situations in the future.

[Heporlathic]

 

Honestly I think the average joe would not be able to walk while swinging an axe full force and aiming for a Z's head. I know if personally I stepped forward while swinging I'd be off balance. If that strike were to miss I may throw the axe out of my hands lol. If I were stepping backwards while swinging I'd be liable to trip.

 

I think that, just like any other video game, combat is about timing. Combat in PZ will never emulate real life combat with swinging weapons, but you can practice at what the game is requiring you to do. E.g. swing, step, swing, run, swing, step, etc.

Mister average/not-average Joe/not-Joe, please try it out for yourself.

For the first lesson, stand somewhere and swing something in the air.

For the second lesson, take a step backwards as you swing.

 

I think your opinion probably comes from never having tried it yourself. Your opinion will be more valid if you actually try it yourself. It does not take years of martial training to be able to swing something while stepping and not lose the weapon.

I just went outside and did it. As I step backwards I feel my momentum and it is very easy to just continue turning around and run off in the opposite direction.

 

I think what you mean is not hitting while running, but you mean a swing-animation where the character takes a step forward, right?

[Leoquent]

Running in a Zombocalypse seems a bad idea.

Walking backwards while fighting off a Zombie seems a bad idea (though i do that ingame, I would never do that if shit got real).

Always turning and running infight in this game seems an odd behaviour.

I like the increased risks by dealing with more than one zombie at once and how much the mechanics force you to retreat in time or die.

Zombies are slow. There is absolutely no need to run, except you made a bad decision beforehand.

You fought against 7 zombies and died? Well, you shouldn't have done that.

As a sidenote: I didn't know that "hold down the attack button" works efficiently in this game.

[ulfstein]

Currently if you are being chased by zombies and you've got an axe, if you want to hit one you need to stop and turn around and swing, and then turn around and start running again. This just got my guy bitten and I got annoyed that it happened because you cannot step as you swing in this. Stepping actually adds power to swings.

 

Here's what you can do in reality: When running, stop with your right foot forwards and turn your body so that you are looking in the direction that was behind you before you stopped, so it can be said that without your feet moving your left foot is forwards. Now as you swing at the zombie move your left foot back and make your right foot be forwards, as you swing with power at the zombie's head. Now when you turn your body again it can be said that your left foot becomes the one in front of you because of where you are facing. Then put your right foot forth and alternate which one is forwards in a process called running. Done quickly you are seen to spin around in a circle as you run.

 

Here's another thing you can do in reality: If zombies approach you and you are facing them with your left foot is forwards, then step backwards with your left foot as you swing. Then with the next swing step backwards with your right foot. This way you are seen to be walking backwards, with each step being an opportinity to strike.

 

Here is another: When running, look behind you to see the persuer. Stop with your left foot forwards so that your body is turning to the right, and turn your upper body so that with the weapon in your right hand you may swing with power at the head of your persuer, and then turn around again in whichever direction feels right and continue running.

 

Here's how it works in the current project zomboid version: Stop running and turn around and swing and swing and swing and turn around and step and turn around and swing and turn around and run. You can walk backwards without swinging, but to swing you must be still.

 

My suggestion is that if you are pressing movement keys to move backwards as you swing or push zombies, your guy steps.

 

I just tested this with my sword. There are a couple problems with it.  First if you are running forward and stop with right foot forward then turn around.  Your left foot would then be forward, but your right foot and left foot are in reverse locations.  When you are in a normal left foot forward stance, your left is left of your head, and your right is behind you to the right.  With the method you've implied, your left is forward, but in the right position while your right foot is backwards and to the left. This gives the enemy your back and, not only gives your opponent a bigger surface to grab or hit, since a normal position is used to prevent one from being pushed back, someone could easily make you fall forwards with a slight push given that you've given the opponent your back. Thus this stance is not sound to begin with.

 

In addition to this in order to step your left foot back to swing, your left foot has to move across your center of balance going from forward right to back left. This not only reduces the force of the swing as energy is lost conserving angular momentum which would normally go to the sword in a normal forward step, it reduces your range, In addition to this, if your hit lands while your foot is in transition, the force of the zombie moving forward being translated through the weapon and the inertia caused by the vector of your previous running motion would cause you to fall back wards before your left foot is in a position to brace the impact. Thus to prevent this from happening you have to half sword your weapon to time it so that your foot is braced for the impact reducing the range even further to about 8 inches.

 

To resume running you would have to again spin your body bringing your right foot which is now forward right to the forward right again after the turn. This means that your right foot has to translate across your center of balance again thus adding another risk of falling. In addition to this, the zombie is 8 inches away from you if your hit landed, and you have again given your back to your opponent meaning if it pushes you, you will fall forward. You can prevent a push by raking your sword behind your back from right to left, but due to angular momentum if the sword makes contact, the force will cause the blade to either to move opposite the strike thus causing you to turn less than expected which will squares you against the vector of the run which is an instant fall down, or the zombie adds force to the rake speeding up your turn which will rip your left hip out of socket. Either way, this is a highly improbable maneuver to pull off unless you have advanced martial arts training as even moderate training to do a half sword and back rake could land you with a side of your head cracked against a stone on the ground or your hip dislocated. 

 

One of the few martial artists i've seen that move backwards and fight was mike tyson. Even then he never spun around, he kepts his back away from his opponent and ran backwards while punching instead of running away.  In this sense the current game mechanic works except that it makes you stop to swing when in reality you would swing while moving backwards, but i will repeat, changing directions while swinging and moving is very dangerous. Even in TWD you have to switch the position of your feet to perform a round kick, but to do this, you do it far enough away from your opponent that they cant hit you while your feet translate across your center of balance, and you only give your back as you are thrusting forward while spinning reducing the chance of the opponent knocking you on your ass by pushing you back. The same can not be applied to this position as you are thrusting backwards as you are swinging thus a push would only add to a backwards movement.

 

If you are doing this in your back yard invite a friend along to push you while you do it to see how ineffective it is.

[Demonic_Kat]

 

Honestly I think the average joe would not be able to walk while swinging an axe full force and aiming for a Z's head. I know if personally I stepped forward while swinging I'd be off balance. If that strike were to miss I may throw the axe out of my hands lol. If I were stepping backwards while swinging I'd be liable to trip.

 

I think that, just like any other video game, combat is about timing. Combat in PZ will never emulate real life combat with swinging weapons, but you can practice at what the game is requiring you to do. E.g. swing, step, swing, run, swing, step, etc.

Mister average/not-average Joe/not-Joe, please try it out for yourself.

For the first lesson, stand somewhere and swing something in the air.

For the second lesson, take a step backwards as you swing.

 

I think your opinion probably comes from never having tried it yourself. Your opinion will be more valid if you actually try it yourself. It does not take years of martial training to be able to swing something while stepping and not lose the weapon.

I just went outside and did it. As I step backwards I feel my momentum and it is very easy to just continue turning around and run off in the opposite direction.

 

 

I feel kind of like you're trying to say that my personal observations about my own body limitations are wrong and that I should go buy an axe from the store to perform potentially dangerous activites.

 

I'm going to say no.

 

I'm glad that you can perform such functions though. Congratulations.

 

Also, I'm not a Mister.

[bobchaos]

If you want to break through a skull (or spine for that matter), you need force, and it's very difficult to channel force appropriately without being firmly planted on the ground. In most martial arts, and pretty much all those that focus on using weapons, when you're attempting to deliver a powerful blow you do so by pushing hard against the ground with your legs or by getting a hand from gravity (striking from above), in which case you still need to be on solid footing so you can control your weapon and not hack your own damn leg/break the weapon on the ground if you miss.
 
Can you move while swinging a weapon? With training, probably. Can you deliver a killing blow while doing so? Probably not. And these guys are zombies, anything short of a killing blow won't do you much good. Before you go naming some obscure martial art that relies on movement like capoeira or whatnot keep in mind the character is not a world renowned black belt, he's an average joe.

[Man_In_The_Purple_Hat]

I have an axe out in my garage, if i were to swing it at full force i would probably break my spine, axes are far from light, the moment I picked it up i though, damn this really wouldn't be a great zombie fighting weapon unless you were pretty beefy, which I am not haha.

[Trojan_Turps]

Swinging an axe is very different to swinging a bat/stick. There is a lot of weigh on the end of it. This weight could/would throw you off balance if you weren't careful. I don't use axes very often but when I do I always feel like I'm about to cut my foot off

You can step in to a powerful swing/attack but this still ends with your feet firmly planted on the floor. This can kind of be done in game at the moment anyway.

Melee combat does feel rather clunky at the mo but I think they are working on it.

[ulfstein]

If you want to break through a skull (or spine for that matter), you need force, and it's very difficult to channel force appropriately without being firmly planted on the ground. In most martial arts, and pretty much all those that focus on using weapons, when you're attempting to deliver a powerful blow you do so by pushing hard against the ground with your legs or by getting a hand from gravity (striking from above), in which case you still need to be on solid footing so you can control your weapon and not hack your own damn leg/break the weapon on the ground if you miss.

 

Can you move while swinging a weapon? With training, probably. Can you deliver a killing blow while doing so? Probably not. And these guys are zombies, anything short of a killing blow won't do you much good. Before you go naming some obscure martial art that relies on movement like capoeira or whatnot keep in mind the character is not a world renowned black belt, he's an average joe.

 

I really don't want this to become a martial arts thread because there are a lot of people who train at crappy dojos that aren't actual fighting and spread misinformation most of what they are taught is not full force so they don't feel the transfer of energy/recoil coming from the opponent, but with that being said the weapon based martial arts i've trained with particularly german langschwert. you are in a constant state of movement. In boxing, you plant your feet and rotate your hips only when you want to deal a power blow, but in longswording, you move both legs as you twist your entire body into the swing using angular momentum to help you deliver force (video links listed below explaining how to swing). My standard opener (guards in brackets) [Tag], step forward w/mittlehau, [Ochs], step forward w/Stechen, then [Longort], (then if applicable, unterhau [ochs]) has me making forward swings moving me at least 10 feet forward, then 6 feet back with a back backward unterhau [Ochs], mittlehau [ochs], mittlehau [Tag].

 

Notice with this combat style, I am swinging into guards as I move forward or backward, so at no point should I be victim of a counter attack, and notice that these are forward backward movements. The reason for this is that typically in weapon fighting you keep yourself out of range of your opponents weapon, so you have so swing into range so you can hit, defensing yourself against a counter attack, then you retreat back out of range swinging into guards, at this point you may pivot to change the angle of your next attack. The only langschwert attack the uses a planted foot is the Zornhau in which you swing the sword starting behind your back like a baseball bat, but unlike a baseball bat swing you pivot on the planted foot launching a rotation off the back foot moving it into a forward position.  This is highly telegraphed and only really used on charging enemies who cant react in time to defend themselves.

 

 With my Iaido training which has very similar strikes and guards to my german langsword (what works works no matter the culture), however, it makes much more use of side steps and turns since due to it using a single edged weapon without a cross guard, its defence comes from positioning, and you will have strikes while doing a complete turn as a standard skill. As such, moving and striking is actually the ideal way to strike and give the most impact as you can more acceleration from the angular moment from the rotation of your body than what you can produce by stomping the ground. The reason non-weapon martial arts don't do this is because you will most likely rip your shoulder or elbow out of socket, and forward punches are less telegraphed than swings.  When I was doing a biomechanics research project in boxing, I got up to a punch of 550 lbs.  once i exceeded 300lbs, I was in dire need of wrist wraps (look at the hands of british bareknuckle boxers) and at 500lbs a miss timed punch would cause so much recoil that it almost threw my shoulder out. This requires the shoulders to be fortified with significant amount of muscle.  So that point is that, there are better ways of generating force than planting your feet, but this is not very applicible to non-weapon based martial arts because the frailty of the human body can not handle higher stress loads that these maneuvers call for.  I ocassionally see marine boxers do a full body twist punch, but i wouldn't recommend it.

 

The difference between Iaido/german langschwert and what the OP is suggesting, is that one would never turn against the direct they were running, as you can't get into any effective stance, your are in an unbalanced position, and you've increased risk of injury particular when you have an opponent involved.

 

videos:

longsword swing 

why longsword doesn't plant feet https://youtu.be/V2mKj-bD_oU

german longsword in action with some armour  https://youtu.be/ohmLaZHStmI there is some side stepping, but not as much as with katana based martial arts, and notice change in foot positions

german lon vs kendo (kendo will not save you) https://youtu.be/dov2ePI1bHw

[bobchaos]

Before you go naming some obscure martial art that relies on movement like capoeira or whatnot keep in mind the character is not a world renowned black belt, he's an average joe.

too late :/

[Gaffa Tape Warrior]

 

[...]

Here's what you can do in reality: When running, stop with your right foot forwards and turn your body so that you are looking in the direction that was behind you before you stopped, so it can be said that without your feet moving your left foot is forwards. Now as you swing at the zombie move your left foot back and make your right foot be forwards, as you swing with power at the zombie's head. Now when you turn your body again it can be said that your left foot becomes the one in front of you because of where you are facing. Then put your right foot forth and alternate which one is forwards in a process called running. Done quickly you are seen to spin around in a circle as you run.

[...]

I just tested this with my sword. There are a couple problems with it. First if you are running forward and stop with right foot forward then turn around. Your left foot would then be forward, but your right foot and left foot are in reverse locations. When you are in a normal left foot forward stance, your left is left of your head, and your right is behind you to the right. With the method you've implied, your left is forward, but in the right position while your right foot is backwards and to the left. This gives the enemy your back and, not only gives your opponent a bigger surface to grab or hit, since a normal position is used to prevent one from being pushed back, someone could easily make you fall forwards with a slight push given that you've given the opponent your back. Thus this stance is not sound to begin with.

[...]

 

Maybe it could be made to work with different footwork? I just went outside again and tried it with a one-handed axe and then with a two-handed bit of wood, and my footwork was not exactly as described. Below is a square:

NW-----------NE

|                     |

|                     |

|                     |

SW-----------SE

When moving forwards my left foot landed on SW. Then, knowing I was about to turn around, I put my right foot not on NE, but on NW. This allowed my body to turn better. I was swinging with my left foot above the ground and still moving.

It should be possible to stop zombies from grabbing or pushing you by looking over your shoulder so that you can manage your distance well.

Below is an image:

Something like that looks good for what I am talking about. (It is from a book written some time close to AD 1400)

And also, wow, you've got a sword! I want an actual sword one day. 

 

Before you go naming some obscure martial art that relies on movement like capoeira or whatnot keep in mind the character is not a world renowned black belt, he's an average joe.

I would be interested to know of any armed martial art in which people stand still to swing. If moving one's feet when swinging weapons makes so much sense that they did it all over the world, then the average Joe should notice the merit in it too. The average Joe who seriously wants to survive and practices swinging things to get good at hitting zombies.

 

 

PS

George Silver, an Englishman who published a book in 1599, said that if somebody rushes towards you then you should step back and it him on the hand or the head (in sword fighting). Although, George Silver wrote that hitting someone on the head with a sword could mean death, and that swords could cut off arms and sometimes heads, but one of the moderators on this forum has said that he has studied swords for a lot of his life, and that single-edged swords cannot remove heads or split skulls, so George Silver was wrong, so maybe George Silver was also wrong about stepping backwards in a sword fight. A moderator has also disagreed with the thought that two-handed swords could cut off heads, so Hans Talhoffer was wrong too. Many witnesses of sword fights in history must have been wrong also.

 

PPS

The PS above was not really my opinion. I was just saying what I would further think if it was actually my opinion. People are better at disagreeing with other people than with themselves, and you could equally read it as "this person said this, but George Silver said something else, so this person was mistaken",

Edited December 19, 2015 by Gaffa Tape Warrior

[ulfstein]

 

 

NW-----------NE

|                     |

|                     |

|                     |

SW-----------SE

When moving forwards my left foot landed on SW. Then, knowing I was about to turn around, I put my right foot not on NE, but on NW. This allowed my body to turn better. I was swinging with my left foot above the ground and still moving.

It should be possible to stop zombies from grabbing or pushing you by looking over your shoulder so that you can manage your distance well.

 

 

PS

George Silver, an Englishman who published a book in 1599, said that if somebody rushes towards you then you should step back and it him on the hand or the head (in sword fighting). Although, George Silver wrote that hitting someone on the head with a sword could mean death, and that swords could cut off arms and sometimes heads, but one of the moderators on this forum has said that he has studied swords for a lot of his life, and that single-edged swords cannot remove heads or split skulls, so George Silver was wrong, so maybe George Silver was also wrong about stepping backwards in a sword fight. A moderator has also disagreed with the thought that two-handed swords could cut off heads, so Hans Talhoffer was wrong too. Many witnesses of sword fights in history must have been wrong also.

 

 

Ok, i retried it with your foot inline method and spun, then spun again with little problem.  However, with a target to hit, the problem is that as soon as the sword makes contact, your spin ends with a stomp of your left foot in a normal guard position, I was able to keep balance though I could feel how it could injure the ankle to come full stop like that with momentum wanting to carry me backwards, but i have 300lbs of momentum to deal with. Even then, i was flat footed on left and thus took another deliberate spin to return which I would initiate by pushing a zombie away at the same time.  This is much safer than the original spin, but still carries risk, but maybe just the same amount of risk as walking backward normally would (This makes me wish the game had a mechanic for falling/tripping chance when walked backwards like M&B does) so kadus to you, but i'd expect only a character with martial training or experience fighting while running away would actually carry this out without harming themselves as I have four different schools of training and I didn't immediately understand what you were getting at, as none i've trained with ever utilized running.  The only martial arts I could think of that involve running would probably be ancient greek dueling methods.

 

As for your ps note though, I feel that was alittle distasteful. The quality of one's argument and attack of one's argument should not be based on who is presenting the argument. Though this is a tactic that is used to sway simpletons in a debate arena where the ethos of an argument is equally as important as the logos or pathos, this is not, as far as I know, a debate arena, and thus it has no place in a civil discussion. As a result, jabs such as "a moderator said this or that" is not in good taste.  As it doesn't matter if they are a moderator or not, as being a moderator should not have any bearing on the quality of the argument whether it is good or bad.  A more appropriate way of saying it would have been "according to such and such author, you can chop off heads and limbs with ease"

 

The conversation on whether or not swords and such can chop heads and such, however, is a non-sequitur to begin with since we are talking about a game that only includes improvised weapons such as bats and golf clubs (i only brought up my sword because its the closest approximation i have to a bat, and I don't have a hammer long enough to simulate an axe), and obviously since the majority of people here are saying that you could probably only land a heavy blow if feet are planted this is going to be the default that someone in a zombie apocalypse is going to turn to whether they know better or not until they've become accustom to the situation. The most trained person when attacked while flatfooted will react as if he is flatfooted; i've experienced this as a bouncer at a bar when fights would just randomly break out around me at times, it would take at least three hits or so of gut reactions before my training would kick in.  Also, i would like to note that not all the people who wrote treatises actually fought or only wrote from the perspective of fensing/duels, not actual combat.

 

So my bottomline is, only a few people in this world are actually trained in an actual "martial" combative styles and even fewer would utilize that training when it is actually needed, so I don't suspect that, "you can actually get away with this if you know better" should be the norm for the game. What may be realistic for you may not be realistic for another unless we all have had the same experiences, since that is not possible, it is best to simulate an average experience or an average cluster.  This average cluster has spoken that moving while fighting is probably a bad idea meaning that most people would not take the risk of running and fighting at the same time in an apocalypse (they wouldn't fight while constantly walking backwards either, but thats another topic). Maybe in the least the devs could make it so that as you level up in combat you may move alittle bit, but making it a main feature would break the immersion factor for most people who would view such things as unrealistic as it is unrealistic to their perception of the world.

[Demonic_Kat]

I have yet to come by a sword in Project Zomboid.

 

Is there a manual on footwork while fighting the undead with fire axes somewhere? From the way this conversation is going it sounds like one is required to be fighting with one. Or years of practice.

 

Which brings me back to my point: Fancy footwork and axe fighting isn't for the average joe.

[Insidiousness]

I have no problem killing zombies with the axe.. But that's just me.

I play with nerfed weapons and shove