RELEASED: Build 30.12

[RobertJohnson]

It's not a post for suggestion tho

[GothicGhost]

The erosion mod is going to be nice can't wait

[Suomiboi]

A few questions about the erosion and custom maps. How will the new forests and such affect on the mapping tools? Will we possibly get an update for them at some point, as I suppose the rules etc will need changing to accommodate the new forest models? And will this require changes in current maps to work with the new forests? (I assume we at least have to do a new bmp to tmx to get the new forests? Or do we?)

 

I know this might be better directed for EasyP, but since it's a relevant subject I decided to ask here.

 

Awesome work as always guys and gal!

 

Thanks!!

Edited November 6, 2014 by Suomiboi

[Moose65]

• Wall vines creep up some outside walls, sometimes growing over windows.

Will we have a way to remove the window wines? Perhaps its time to add in a machete

 

also......

 

• Burns

How: FIRE!

Symptoms: Huge amounts of pain, and severe health loss.

Treatment: Burns must be treated with a clean bandage, then bandaged again - and regularly kept clean. The recovery time is lengthy.

 

R.I.P. Oven Gloves I was looking forward to laughing at all these people who have been grabbing their Stir Fry's out of the campfire with their bare hands.

[Bennytheowl]

 

A bite can and should be 100 percent fatal regardless of amputation or not. But I'm not against amputation for other reasons, like catastrophic knee injuries or infected wounds brought on by lack of treatment and unsanitary living conditions.

 

I think I read somewhere that bites are 96% fatal. I like having that 4% chance, since it makes me want to play it out to the end because there is a small chance I could fight it.

 

 

You mean I committed suicide with bleach when i could have survived the bite after all?....great..

[f3rret]

The wiki contradicts itself. It says 96% here:

http://pzwiki.net/wiki/Injuries#Zombie_Related_Injuries

 

and "guaranteed" here:

http://pzwiki.net/wiki/Zombie

 

I choose to believe the 96%, even though it goes against canon.

Actually, that could be a good sandbox option. Infection chance for scratches and bites, within reasonable limits.

[EasyPickins]

A few questions about the erosion and custom maps. How will the new forests and such affect on the mapping tools? Will we possibly get an update for them at some point, as I suppose the rules etc will need changing to accommodate the new forest models? And will this require changes in current maps to work with the new forests? (I assume we at least have to do a new bmp to tmx to get the new forests? Or do we?)

 

I know this might be better directed for EasyP, but since it's a relevant subject I decided to ask here.

 

Awesome work as always guys and gal!

 

Thanks!!

 

The Erosion stuff doesn't require any changes to the mapping process.  It replaces existing tree types with the new types the first time a part of the map is loaded.  I just ran around Bedford Falls and it was all good.

[lemmy101]

The wiki contradicts itself. It says 96% here:

http://pzwiki.net/wiki/Injuries#Zombie_Related_Injuries

 

and "guaranteed" here:

http://pzwiki.net/wiki/Zombie

 

I choose to believe the 96%, even though it goes against canon.

Actually, that could be a good sandbox option. Infection chance for scratches and bites, within reasonable limits.

I'll go as far to say that the muddy water and ambiguity here may not entirely be unintentional on our part

[Rathlord]

Never give up until you're dead.

[Kajin]

 

• Snow covers the world on below-freezing rain days. Snow slowly melts away on days when the temperature is above zero. It's Kentucky though, so only expect about 12 days of snowfall per year.

 

Not sure where you guys are getting this information from. Last winter we got about a month and a half to two whole months of snow. It sucked very much.

[Rathlord]

 

 

• Snow covers the world on below-freezing rain days. Snow slowly melts away on days when the temperature is above zero. It's Kentucky though, so only expect about 12 days of snowfall per year.

 

Not sure where you guys are getting this information from. Last winter we got about a month and a half to two whole months of snow. It sucked very much.

 

 

Weather statistics for Muldraugh show an average of 6 inches of snowfall a year, trending over the last hundred years or so.

 

They're actually being very generous.

 

Citation: http://www.bestplaces.net/climate/city/kentucky/muldraugh

http://www.usa.com/muldraugh-ky-weather.htm#HistoricalSnow

http://average-snowfall.findthebest.com/l/17749/Muldraugh-Kentucky

http://www.myforecast.com/bin/climate.m?city=18303&zip_code=40155&metric=false&selectedMonthNum=1

[EnigmaGrey]

Mind you, that's the average for those statistics, so there are going to be outlying years . . . but that seems to mirror my limited research on it a few months ago.

Snow storms are generally an inch or two, but accumulated snow can rarely reach about a foot and last for a while?

[Djackzz]

RJ you get a clyde! 

[Burianu]

Great work as usual, guys!  Loving it.

[Gorkhun]

By the way, anything taken under consideration concerning logs in forage?  Would suck with the new medical system to find yourself with a back injury for suddenly becoming over carry capacity status for automatically picking it up.

[Moose65]

By the way, anything taken under consideration concerning logs in forage?  Would suck with the new medical system to find yourself with a back injury for suddenly becoming over carry capacity status for automatically picking it up.

Since it wasn't specifically mentioned I doubt that moodle has been re-vamped to function as the tooltip says. They would more than likely rework foraging before then, because as of now the system could use some improvement in how the items are handled.

[King jjwpenguin]

I think that there should be a doctor job that you can pick to start out with. It could make you better with medical stuff, make your healing skill jump faster, or it could just make you learn faster from medical books, (Assuming that there are medical books in some places like the hospitals and pharmacy) 

[Suomiboi]

I think that there should be a doctor job that you can pick to start out with. It could make you better with medical stuff, make your healing skill jump faster, or it could just make you learn faster from medical books, (Assuming that there are medical books in some places like the hospitals and pharmacy) 

It's planned. Here's a list of professions that are already hiding in the depths of the code :

PoliceOfficer, ParkRanger, ConstructionWorker, MilitarySoldier, MilitaryOfficer, SecurityGuard, FireOfficer, Salesperson, ITWorker, OfficeWorker, Unemployed, TruckDriver, Farmer, Cashier, ShopClerk, FastFoodCook, Cook, Chef, Burglar, Drugdealer, Nurse, Doctor, Waiter, CustomerService, Janitor, Secretary, Bookkeeper, Accountant, Teacher

[Woodwose]

The new treatment-system sound cool, but:

 

Irl, cleaning a wound - ANY wound - BEFORE it gets infected is one of the first reflex someone with a minimum of medical background will do. There should be a higher probability of wound infection if you didn't get it cleaned asap.
If it comes to wound infection, you sure needs to keep disinfecting it, but what you really want is find antibiotics before your wound infection becomes a blood infection and kills you.

 

This is absolutely true. Disinfecting a wound is a way to prevent an infection, but not to cure ist. That doesn't make sense. Infections should really need antibiotics.

[harakka]

For a layman-readable reference on first aid and other healthcare related things in environments without access to high tech hospitals or equipment, "Where there is no doctor" by Werner & co is highly recommended.

 

Edit: and wherever the instructions in the book begin or end with "seek medical help immediately," in the context of PZ you can mentally replace it with this.

[angrysquirrel]

I'm feeling woosy just thinking of getting those injuries and having to perform medical treatment on myself.  I can't stand the sight of blood.

[Sheo]

Hey, I just made a forum account to point this out to you guys. As someone with a bit more than layman knowledge medical practice, this really bothers me:

 

 

• Lodged bullet

How: Get shot!
Symptoms: Major blood loss, major pain and severe health loss.
Treatment : Bullet must be removed with a suture needle holder or tweezers, disinfected, stitched and bandaged.

 

 

 

 

 

Bullets are not normally removed as standard treatment if a bullet stays in the body.

Believe it or not, bullets are small items that end up being completely sterile due to the heat of punching through the atmosphere at speeds breaking the sound barrier, and in standard medical procedure if the bullet isn't determined to be dangerously close to an artery or lodged in a joint and thus impeding it's operation, they will leave it where it is and your body will heal around it. Some bullet wounds, years later, will even reject the bullet and crown, surface, and then one night while you're sleeping, will entirely leave your body again. This would happen gradually after the wound is fully healed. Or the bullet may remain in your body for the rest of your life.

As Project Zomboid is often based in realism, I think you should really change this. If not realism for the sake of realism, perhaps consider that it is very jarring for someone with a medical background to see mistakes like this. Also, exactly what someone else pointed out about the infection thing. Open, unclean wounds should be a vector for infection, and all cleaning it and disinfecting the bandage should do is lower that risk. Once infected, someone should need antibiotics.

Consider the use of antibiotics to tie into your Project nuke the end game. Because as anyone can tell you pre-penicilin, an infection without antibiotics is very serious and could be lethal, especially from a deep wound. Since manufactured medicines are going back to the dark ages, this gives you a chance to really let infection shine as a major player-killer.

EDIT:

Also, I believe you should have two different bullet wound types. Pistol rounds are more likely to get stopped in the body due to their lower-velocity nature, but rifle rounds, small caliber and high caliber are a different beast entirely, and most likely will not stop in your body.

In general, pistols are a much less lethal weapon than a rifle. Without hitting a specifically needed internal organ with a shot, a person is very likely to survive a pistol round. People have been documented being shot dozens of times and surviving.

Rifle rounds however, as I said are different beasts. A small, high-velocity rifle round is likely to create a much more traumatic wound channel that bleeds quite profusely, as the small unbalanced bullet 'tumbles' end over end as it passes through the body (I am not making this up or joking about it, feel free to do a google on 5.56 tumble). Even without a central nervous system hit or lungs/heart hit rifle rounds can be easily fatal, and due to the high velocity nature it's likely the bullet will leave the body entirely.

Large caliber rifle rounds are even more likely to leave the body immediately, and due to their nature with having greater inertia and force delivered to the target, a .308 or similar round is likely to smash through bones, leave a secondary wound channel from cavitation (the flesh rapidly expanding and tearing itself in a quasi-shockwave) and leave the body again.

So really only pistol rounds should be getting lodged in the body, or ball-shot from a shotgun. Really, only pistol rounds should be very treatable as well. Most wounds inflicted by civilians/criminals are by handgun these days, and that's the only reason they have as low of a mortality rate as they do. 

One most likely is not going to survive multiple rifle rounds to the torso without surgery.

[EnigmaGrey]

Doesn't even have to be a sterilized projectile, depending on the risk/reward of removing it. Had an instructor with part of a chisel embedded in his wrist (removing it would have damaged an artery and several nerves.).
 

[Sheo]

I'd forgotten about that factor, but that's entirely true as well. Generally, in medicine if invasive surgery isn't strictly needed it's avoided.

[CaptKaspar]

*cut* read above if needed.

 

Great points Sheo! I did not know about any of this and subsequently Googled what you brought up.

 

http://www.trauma.org/index.php/main/article/601/

 

http://www.emsworld.com/article/10319706/gunshot-wounds

 

There can't be a better time to fix and address this issue than now. I for one can wait another week or two on the medical system overhaul for the sake of realism.