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RELEASED: Build 30.12


RobertJohnson

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I just wanted to say one thing about the new exhaustion system. See many posting dislike or desire to go back to something different. Fine tweaking to balance aside, I like where we're headed with this new system. Primarily for this:

 

My largest complaint in the game is how quickly you can "rush" builds. Survival games always, always penalize those who focus on one area and not paying attention to ensuring they have all their bases covered. Planning is 90% of survival. When I spend all day (or two, or three as people I see most do) working on fortifications, I should suffer a meaningful penalty elsewhere. I should have trouble fighting hordes because I didn't bother to build or find more weapons. I should be scrambling to find fuel for that fire to keep me warm (although extreme temp doesn't cause HP loss so you could ignore it).

 

This system doesn't implement any of those ideas, but it is a step in the right direction imo. By trying to instill meaningful penalties for not staggering yourself and planning your activities better, the meta will improve significantly and with less intrusion, like say scripted event on X day (which I'm not against). Lets just get out in the open here. The meta is extremely important here, even to those who don't care about it. The meta is what will keep this game going, pulling players back in, and just as important, draw those new players in.

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New update! 30.8:

  • Reduced a tad endurance loss when running
  • Changed endurance loss when swinging, it's now tied to the damage you do
  • Reduced a LOT the endurance used for stab weapon (even more when you do a close kill move)
  • You can now use the module in result recipe, like Result=farming.Tomato
  • Added canned food: add vegetables (5) inside an empty jar + water + vinegar + sugar, cook it and you'll have a 2-3 months food preservation, Jar Lids will prob be needed in a future update, you can jar those vegetables for now:
    • Tomatoes
    • Bell peppers
    • Red radishes
    • Leeks
    • Eggplants
    • Potatoes
    • Carrots
  • Added a "OnCooked" on the items script to call a lua function when.. Well, the item is cooked :P
  • Added logs stacks recipe: 2 logs and 2 ropes to make a logs stack that weight 1/3 less (also with 3 and 4 logs/ropes)
  • Added more translations
  • Reduced the forage loot rate with the sandbox options
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Do i have to start a new game for jars and vinegar to spawn?

Also i'm really liking the option to be able preserve food, lovely update.

 

I'm think it's been said that loot only generates when you first open the container. So if you haven't looted a spot, it has a chance to have the new items.

 

But I might be wrong on this, so don't quote me. 

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Just because the devs are reading this thread and it affects exertion. After reaching foraging level 3 I find logs. This can hurt my back and it will decrease my endurance and ability to run away. I therefore suggest to have them spawn on the ground or only visible in the ground inventory.

 

Before I test this build again, one more thing: Because I play with the 8 months in preset I mainly use crafted tools as weapons. They break easily and I then drop them and equip the next one. This takes about the same amount of time it took to recover from short time exhaustion. And finally I am no longer surprised by zombies who were hidden among the trees in the town with all the quick overgrowth of nature. All of them are now to be found on the road. Unless proper sneaking is in I don't know how this will tie in.


Just because the devs are reading this thread and it affects exertion. After reaching foraging level 3 I find logs. This can hurt my back and it will decrease my endurance and ability to run away. I therefore suggest to have them spawn on the ground or only visible in the ground inventory.

 

Before I test this build again, one more thing: Because I play with the 8 months in preset I mainly use crafted tools as weapons. They break easily and I then drop them and equip the next one. This takes about the same amount of time it took to recover from short time exhaustion. And finally I am no longer surprised by zombies who were hidden among the trees in the town with all the quick overgrowth of nature. All of them are now to be found on the road. Unless proper sneaking is in I don't know how this will tie in.

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The canning sounds like an awesome addition! Are there any plans for preserving meat? I guess that could wait until we can hunt more things... I'm only mentioning it because I saw some BBC documentary on the weekend that showed how to preserve meat:

- Cut meat in chunks

- Cover in salt for a day or so to draw out the moisture on the outside

- Put meat in brine (salt+water) for 3 days to draw out the moisture from the inside

- Dry the meat and pack in salt again, will not spoil for a few months

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I'm not sure if these are bugs or not...

First of, in sandbox with the normal zombie setting and zombie count, I noticed that their sight and other senses have improved a lot, even though they aren't eagle eyed or something. Another thing, suddenly there are a lot more zombies, this all doesn't seem right?

And secondly, I've had this since I bought the game (built 27 or so) and when I run in the rain for hours, I never get sick. Is this normal? It's kind of weird... 

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Thought for a tweak for the new zombies-luring-each-other feature :

Right now when a large event happens (such as a house alarm), the massive group that comes to form then become a swarm of constant weird movements, zombies luring each other on very small distances which looks kinda silly. It kinda looks like a metal concert mosh pit more than a dead horde :D

What about changing it so zombies do not lure each other at very close distance ? since zombies being real close to each other would actually hear the same noise that a player would make and move toward it on their own, but that would prevent the chain reaction of massive hordes attracting itself.

But if a zombie actually gets lured by the player and walks away from the nearby zombies and its mates didn't, as soon as the zombie leaves the "dead lure-radius", those passive zombies would start being interested in what that the single zombie is doing and start following it.

+

 

Edit 2 :

The "horde attracting itself" thingy might be more game breaking than I first thought : I raided Muldraugh's Police Station alone pretty easily, I ran to the building, broke a window to enter and then rushed the first door to have something to slow them down while speed looting, turned out they stopped banging on the door pretty quickly as they got more interested in each other, then meta-sounds happened, only a small portion of the zombies I could see outside (barelly) moved toward the meta-sounds. They just seemed more interested in each other.

 

Or maybe a re-prioritization depending on their memory level ? Zombies should focus on the player first, then on meta-events when they reach the "end" of their memory and IF the player didn't make any other noise or alarming action, and then kite themselves if there are no other things drawing their attention.

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Alright. Played 30.7 for several hours, two months into the game, and I can't deal with the exertion change anymore. It doesn't make the game challenging and certainly doesn't make it fun. Making the player retreat after every ten minutes of gameplay to spend four minutes "resting" is a really bad design choice. Please, please consider altering this, or making the game mechanic optional (if it isn't already).

Sounds to me like your problem is that you're playing PZ wrong. You're playing it like an arcade action game, and it's not. If you're exhausted all the time, you're probably doing something wrong.

You're not meant to be able to run or fight for hours at a time. In combat, make sure you're not spamming the attack button; you should be charging every swing.

I played for five days straight (doing reasonable things) and didn't get exhausted a single time. That includes fighting and traveling from the trailer park to the police station to the lumber mill to the warehouse. I only got exhausted after falling out of a house and breaking a foot while simultaneously getting caught by a horde.

PZ isn't meant to be about running and fighting all the time, and if you're playing that way don't be surprised that the game punishes you.

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ok others notice it too. Zeds perception level is increased up to the point where its not great at all. I play it mainly as a survival simulation with the occasional scare and witht he current iteration its more like "get away as far as possible if you just see one dreaded zed, even though there might noe be others around"

 

I like risk & reward scenarios and with the current perception iteration theres no way to slowly sneak / walk by zeds to attract less attention. they just see / notice you anyways. 

 

i just had a new sandbox game. was in upper level of a building and that one zed sstraight up walked to the house and stated banging its way in. even though I didnt make any sound at all. 

 

i get it  that it should be hard, but not being able to tone down the perception levels aint my cup of tea.

 

 

btw: i tested with linux & win client. all the same. no change in perception no matter what level i select during game creation. eagly eyed, uncanny hearing and & or smel seems to be the norm now

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@The post about penalizing rush builds.
If you see someone with a house by day two, chances are two or three guys are packing the weapons from the gun stores on day one. So you can decide what is more important the house or the bullets you can use to liberate items from infidels.

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On build 30.8 I have grinded my way up to finally make it to carpentry level 2. I haven't found any book to speed up the process and there aren't enough nails to waste them with the 8 months in preset. Exertion just doesn't affect me at all. I forage to craft axes, chop down some trees and build the log walls. Midday I take a nap and continue in the evening. Rinse and repeat.

 

I will provide more feedback when I go for a lootrun or start some farming. After playing The Long Dark I am used to careful planning and strongly disagree with the negative feedback on the exertion feature so far. This just isn't The Forest.

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oh and btw: the exertion ration / change whatever I haven´t even noticed. whoever tries to fight too many zeds is doing it wrong anyways. 

 

but i catch myself not being able to do the most basic stuff. being able to loot a house undisturbed in even the remotest places is rare.

 

if the plans are to make it a multiplayer- only game where one distracts and the other loots, let me know. I will probably stop playing then :-(

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oh and btw: the exertion ration / change whatever I haven´t even noticed. whoever tries to fight too many zeds is doing it wrong anyways. 

 

but i catch myself not being able to do the most basic stuff. being able to loot a house undisturbed in even the remotest places is rare.

 

if the plans are to make it a multiplayer- only game where one distracts and the other loots, let me know. I will probably stop playing then :-(

 

Meanwhile the NPCs...

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Can you link me please to a tutorial how i update code like this one.

{  /************Misc************/		item marijuana	{		Type		=	Normal,		DisplayName	=	28grams of Medical Marijuana,		Weight		=	.1,		Icon		=	Item_Weed,	}	item joints	{		Count		=	40,		HungerChange	=	+7,		ThirstChange    =	+10,		Weight		=	0.001,		RequireInHandOrInventory	=	Lighter,		Type		=	Food,		UnhappyChange	=	-60,		DisplayName	=	Finely Rolled Joints,		StressChange	=	-60,		Icon		=	Item_Joint,		CustomContextMenu = Smoke,		BoredomChange	=	-20,	}	item coc	{		Count		=	20,		Weight		=	0.001,		Type		=	Food,		UnhappyChange	=	-20,		DisplayName	=	Cocaine,		Icon		=	Item_Cocaine,		BoredomChange	=	+20,		FatigueChange	=	-40,	}	item rollingpapers	{		Type		=	Normal,		DisplayName	=	Rolling Papers,		Weight		=	.01,		Icon		=	Item_rollingpapers,	}	item Outdoorsmanpack	{		WeightReduction	=	90,		Weight	=	1,		Type	=	Container,		Capacity	=	30,		DisplayName	=	Outdoorsman Pack,		Icon	=	Item_outdoorsmanpack,        CanBeEquipped = Back,	}  	/************Recipes************/	recipe Craft Nails	{		Doorknob/Hinge,				Result:Nails,		Time:90.0,			}	recipe Roll Joints	{		marijuana,		rollingpapers,		Result:joints,		Time:100.00,	}}

As i love this game, it makes me crazy that nearly each time i have a good game, a updates came out and breaked some of my mods.

Sure i can play without them, but its less fun and if i cant i would stop play iwbums.

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New update! 30.8:

  • Reduced a tad endurance loss when running
  • Changed endurance loss when swinging, it's now tied to the damage you do
  • Reduced a LOT the endurance used for stab weapon (even more when you do a close kill move)
  • You can now use the module in result recipe, like Result=farming.Tomato
  • Added canned food: add vegetables (5) inside an empty jar + water + vinegar + sugar, cook it and you'll have a 2-3 months food preservation, Jar Lids will prob be needed in a future update, you can jar those vegetables for now:
    • Tomatoes
    • Bell peppers
    • Red radishes
    • Leeks
    • Eggplants
    • Potatoes
    • Carrots
  • Added a "OnCooked" on the items script to call a lua function when.. Well, the item is cooked :P
  • Added logs stacks recipe: 2 logs and 2 ropes to make a logs stack that weight 1/3 less (also with 3 and 4 logs/ropes)
  • Added more translations
  • Reduced the forage loot rate with the sandbox options

 

 

Really like where this is heading now RJ. However, I still think rotten food storage is a problem, BUT, since there is still isn't a renewable way to can goods yet (Vinegar and Sugar will be exhausted eventually), perhaps cooking 4 and 5 could eventually be replaced with advanced canning, using a pressure cooker + water + jar (these foods would obviously have no happiness bonus).

 

That way you can't simply hoard rotten food, and are hard capped on how much you can preserve via jars, while at the same time being re-useable.

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I've certainly got used to losing zombies with this build hehe.

 

But I do still feel, as others have said, that zombie perception does now seem to be increased somewhat, I always have the 'Gracefull' trait and almost always sneaking but it seems to have little effect.  Also as others have said, zombie's arnt just clumping together, there appears to be a significant increase in their numbers.

 

That's fine though, if its intended, I'm learning to adapt,  however,  their increased perception of my character means that they seem to have me take precedence over other, usually much larger distractions,  like a house alarm!  or gun shot.

 

Usually a house alarm or gun shot would sufficiently distract and attract zombies, but now they seem to immediatly switch attention and head directly to me even though if I'm a significant distance away and not moving!  It very much feels as if my aggro generation (to coin an mmo term) has been dialed up somewhat. 

 

Its okay that zombies are increased in number and that they are more perceptive, but reducing the effective of tools to deal with them seems frustrating, causing a distraction is one of the few ways to clear an area and sneak on by.  is it possible to increase the aggro generation of envoirmental effects?

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