Zombies need to be "meatier"

[EnigmaGrey]

And to EG, this started off as a discussion thread btw.

Does that somehow invalidate previous discussion on it, just because it originated in a different sub-forum?

[Viceroy]

I would not say it invalidates it, the discussion here centered more around different ways to add to the "meaty feel" (We really need a better term for this ) than specifically to one means or another. If the rest of the thread is covering ground already covered then surely the first post also does so. After all, things pointed to within it is also pointed to in the threads you linked. One of which is literally a ticket on the tracker I also linked to as a reference to expand the discussion to include. And I did this specifically to broaden the conversation and show that some of these things have been discussed previously.

 

Doesn't mean that we can't comment on it here though, previous discussion does not invalidate this discussion any more than this one invalidates them, I guess is what I am getting at

[rumpel]

yea the zombie mechanics do need some work done, things are just to easy now, but wait if I can recall wasn't people in the past saying things were to hard, meh you can never satisfy everyone. 

 

I agree on this, but from an advanced point of view. I remember too well

that I found it quite difficult to get away esp. when there're masses of

zombies. Right now one knows how to go, to run, to fight, etc. So I think,

perhaps both qualities should be in-game: The zoms as they are now esp.

for starters in some kinda tutorial and/or easy SP mode; and the heavy, 

'fleshy', more present ones for the normal and/or regular SP & MP;

since anyone should play the SP first, I think, to get a feeling for the game

physics esp. crafting, weather, interface, etc., the zoms wouldn't be the

only threat regarding the everlasting quest for water & edible stuff; massive

zoms would be THE ultimate unparalleled life threat. Gosh, I'd love these!

[deprav]

 

I'm once again fulfilled by the official answer :3

Also, when you say "proper physics collision might be a bit CPU hungry", are you talking about an actual physic engine like we can see in most 3D games or some "lines of code" for rudimentary calculation of the (crazy amount of) bodies colliding ? (It might actually be the same thing, I don't know dang about coding and game crafting)

[Bomberman]

 

 

I'm once again fulfilled by the official answer :3

Also, when you say "proper physics collision might be a bit CPU hungry", are you talking about an actual physic engine like we can see in most 3D games or some "lines of code" for rudimentary calculation of the (crazy amount of) bodies colliding ? (It might actually be the same thing, I don't know dang about coding and game crafting)

 

He means the collisions between the zombies and the player(s), NPCs, but also of zombie against zombie.

 

Collisions in games are an entire subject, but, basically, what the CPU (or GPU) would have to do would be something akin to this, as an ideal example: run a check to see whether or not an object (that could be other players, NPCs, or zombies) is intersecting (colliding) with a whole list of other objects (also  players, NPCs, or zombies -- how the list is put together is a whole different ball game but it is an art form in itself) -- when that happens, then something else has to happen. Then you run the same check over and over again for each object against all other objects.

 

See: if you have three objects in the map -- A, B, C, and you want to check their collisions against one another, then you'd have to run the checks for A against B, A against C; then B against A, B against C; and finally C against A, and C against B... which, when eliminating the repeated instances, you can then cut to just A against B, A against C, B against C... that's the list of total checks you have to make to cover the collisions for the three objects... but even that gets complicated when you throw in larger numbers of objects to compare against.

 

Now, adept programmers can come up with increasingly creative solutions beyond my eliminating repeat instances, and make my childish brute-force aproach way, way meatier and powerful, not to mention faster and smoother; but, still, for a game like Zomboid where you have a large, large, LARGE, number of objects (the entities in the game) interacting with themselves, the player(s), the NPCs, and the environment... well, If you are not exactly doing what I outlined in the paragraph above, then some kind of maneuver to approximate a result for either all objects, or just the pertinent ones is necessary, if only for the sake of being economic with the system's resources and not have your PC cry uncle and crash on you.

 

Now, you can see how that may be a bit of a system hog. Especially considering that the calculations have to be carried out each and every moment Zombies, NPCs, whatever, are on sight. That's, well, in a word: tricky. And that is not even taking into account the pathfinding issues... or game logic... or graphics... or the metagame... or the dynamic music... or... well, you get my drift.

 

Good game programming ain't nothing to scoff at. I don't know what kind of crazy voodoo shit the devs are pulling under the hood to keep everything running as well and smooth as it does already, but it is impressive to someone like me who has dabbled in making games as a bit of a hobby. Hence why I'm fine with what I got. I can wait for whenever they deem it necessary to crank in the new animations and stuff.

 

The game is still an alpha, after all. In the meantime, let's try to focus on what is there that already works while we wait. 

 

Cheers.

[deprav]

 

 

Thanks for the presentation ! Tho the game being in alpha is precisely why we get to focus on what is is not working, so the devs can fix it and make the most awesome game ever ;o

 

[bvhv]

zombies do indeed need better "collisions"