"Shitty week for Video games"

[deprav]

Just thought I would share this interesting article so we can talk about it

http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/28/6078391/video-games-awful-week


 

[Connall]

The swatting for those interested:

 

 

Yeah not been an exactly stellar week for gaming right now, but hopefully (at least some of the stuff linked) is for the pursuit of a better industry.

 

I'm going to keep an eye on this thread, mainly because there's a couple of things discussed in that article that have been pretty... shitty for people to say the least. So just a reminder to be lovely if you decide to enter discussions on those topics.

[deprav]

Because most people can't see further than the point of their nose. But as bad as those actions can get, there's one good thing coming out of it : we can clearly see the division between the "two worlds" of videogaming, and I'm pretty sure that's what it's all about in the end.

The conflict between industry and art, between money and passion.
On one hand you have the videogame industry, who has been mainly aiming at the same audience -young males- for a good bunch of years, making games for boys, often conveying easy & stupid primitive states of mind : domination by violence, guns, fast cars, mysoginy and a notion of heroism from another century, all packed up with nice graphics and effects. That's what sells, that's what makes money, and that's what most videogame afficionados are used to play ! The big majority of people fear changes. Just take a look at worldwide politics, we've been doing the same absurd shiet for decades even if we knew it would eventually gets us deep in troubles, but we no lyk changez.
On the other hand you have people who make games out of passion, who want to offer their audience a unique experience, making games based on their own tastes, convictions and ideas of what a good game should be instead of kneeling in front of the all mighty industry (big up TIS <3). Even tho they have to take the financial aspect in consideration so they can carry their project until the "end" without financial issues, their priority still is the Creation.

What is it like concretely, well I've been playing Sleeping Dogs for the giggles during the past days. It's been rather fun to play, the gameplay and mechanics couldn't be easier, it doesn't require much more than a few neurones, you kung-fu beat the shiet out of everyone, you shoot guns, drive fast cars, and girls love your D because you're a bad boy in smooth clothes, shooting guns and driving fast cars. That sums it up pretty good. (Oh yeah and you're an undercover cop, but that just gives you a "variety" of missions, it basically means nothing). Considering most people who'll play the game are younger boys, that not everyone is bright, that some people have troubles drawing a clear line between reality and fiction/movies etc... This is fucking dramatic.

I could take counter-strike as an exemple as well. I've been playing it for 10 years, it's a love-hate story. There's one thing to know about CS : it's all about e-peen, the winner has the bigger e-peen. The end. It is nonetheless interesting to play, tactics and skills play a big part, but the players... on the thousand of matchs I played on the last CS:GO, 95% were with players insulting, dissing etc... always trying to be in a dominative relation with other players. And it's not a very girl friendly environment.

I do think these are just symptoms of a deeper wound caused by our actual civilization, knowing we're worthless in the eyes of our "own" society, the frustration it creates to try to answer unrealistic "human standards" etc...

(I'll finish later, gotta do stuff)

[Kitt Frostpaws]

And they haven't even included the Quinnspiracy stuff.

[DoctahWong]

The swatting for those interested:

 

 

Yeah not been an exactly stellar week for gaming right now, but hopefully (at least some of the stuff linked) is for the pursuit of a better industry.

 

I'm going to keep an eye on this thread, mainly because there's a couple of things discussed in that article that have been pretty... shitty for people to say the least. So just a reminder to be lovely if you decide to enter discussions on those topics.

It's strange how people find swatting fun while it's really a dangerous thing to do. It was a rare occurence... now it's being common, a youtuber called whiteboy7thst also got swatted this month however, unlike Koots. He and his girlfriend were apparently arrested because the team found a stash of marijuana above the legal limit.

 

Would it be ironic if Koots was in the CT team when the SWAT came in?

[Xydonus]

How does Swatting even catch on? If your one of those complete brain dead idiots that has your address plastered on the internet for everyone to see, bad mojo is going to come from it.

 

Otherwise, someone needs to be careful with their choice of friends.

[EnigmaGrey]

How does Swatting even catch on? If your one of those complete brain dead idiots that has your address plastered on the internet for everyone to see, bad mojo is going to come from it.

 

Otherwise, someone needs to be careful with their choice of friends.

Not everyone has the advantage of an anonymizing service to protect their IP registration/provider/e-mail host .etc, let alone voluntary choices made during a lifetime?

Suprisingly easy to let little things out there.

[Connall]

 

How does Swatting even catch on? If your one of those complete brain dead idiots that has your address plastered on the internet for everyone to see, bad mojo is going to come from it.

 

Otherwise, someone needs to be careful with their choice of friends.

Not everyone has the advantage of an anonymizing service to protect their IP registration/provider/e-mail host .etc, let alone voluntary choices made during a lifetime?

Suprisingly easy to let little things out there.

 

 

Yeah the amount of ways someone can get your address is staggering. Not to mention with something like The Creatures they are a registered company, so their address is can certainly be found which is a shame, considering these guys have gone to incredible lengths to hide their office address.

[Connall]

 

How does Swatting even catch on? If your one of those complete brain dead idiots that has your address plastered on the internet for everyone to see, bad mojo is going to come from it.

 

Otherwise, someone needs to be careful with their choice of friends.

 

Wait, what is this Swatting thing? I have never heard of that.

 

just watched the video. Has that seriously caught on enough to get a name now? Holy crap the trouble you will get in for getting caught sicking the swat on innocent people for some kind of joke. People can behave so foolishly.

 

 

It's been a thing for quite a while, the problem is that News outlets started to cover it and made it a very "mainstream" thing. Leading to tons of copycats, it's why LA (I think it's LA anyway) doesn't report on swatting anymore, to try and prevent any copycats. Not to mention to try and deprive satisfaction by those who instigate it.

[Kajin]

I've been following some of the articles and comments regarding the whole Zoe Quinn thing out of sheer morbid curiosity. Kinda wish I hadn't. It's just sickening, some of the crap people are saying.

 

I do my best to avoid stuff like that on the internet. It's just disheartening to see how far we slide back as a whole from incidents like this. Glad a lot of people are showing support, though.

[Batsphinx]

I think this discusses/explains brilliantly: http://dangolding.tumblr.com/post/95985875943/the-end-of-gamers

[Keepbro]

Yeah - I find it amazing how people can change other people's minds by anonymously threatening to rape and kill them on online posts and twitter threads.

 

I think that Sarkeesian is quite right about tired narrative and boring repetition of story lines. I'm not quite into the whole feminism angle as I am a committed man and quite like some of the sexy stuff developers put in games but I do agree with her that its becoming more and more of a cheap ploy to push games. I mean we got rid of booth babes so why not mature the game biz up?

 

[sarcasm mode] Since I disagree a little bit somewhat with what Sarkeesian is trying to say I am going to go and post some rape and death threats on her twitter account.

Maybe that will help me make friends and influence her to coming round to my point of view. [/sarcasm mode]

 

Also what is up with that Fish guy from Fez? Is he trying to become the first man to be killed by 4chan or something? Do you think he enjoys provoking the internet? Why keep taunting the tiger and then getting super emotional and making grand gestures? Its what they want MAN!

 

Now - SENDING A SWAT TEAM TO ANOTHER PLAYERS HOUSE just to stop an online stream is absolutely outrageous and in no way funny. What if the guy had been shotgunned on screen? What if they had done what most SWAT teams and killed his dog? I think that whoever called them in and did that needs to be tracked down and physically beaten by a team of heavily armed men who can and do shoot people for a living.

[_Gold_]

Off topic:

 

It's a bad week for BBC aswell, with the GBBO having a MAJOR controversy, all over a baked alaska...

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2736048/Bake-Off-meltdown-Cook-storms-crying-foul-TV-rival-sabotages-ice-cream-pudding.html

 

And not just that, Diana Beard (The lady who partially caused the incident) had a freak fall losing her sense of smell and taste...we seem to be having a bad week here on earth... 

[Keepbro]

^^

 

Yeah I saw that. That was so clearly an editing trick to make the poor granny look bad. I heard that just after that scene she went and had a serious heart moment thing (ie not really a heart attack but close to one) and left the show. Clearly she was just being an old dodderer having a heart induced stupid moment and it was clearly NOT maliciously intended.

 

What was really funny was the guys reaction when it happened. The guy totally freaked the fuck out and went ape.

[_Gold_]

Sue Perkins, literally went to grab that cake as he threw it in the bin lol...

 

But seriously... that old lady lost her sense of smell and taste thanks to a baked alaska...#

 

She only took it out for 40 secs, and she asked round, put it down, which is when the bearded guy came over to collect it. But the way they made it look was as if she left it out for ages, and forgot about it.

[Kitt Frostpaws]

I've been following some of the articles and comments regarding the whole Zoe Quinn thing out of sheer morbid curiosity. Kinda wish I hadn't. It's just sickening, some of the crap people are saying.

 

I do my best to avoid stuff like that on the internet. It's just disheartening to see how far we slide back as a whole from incidents like this. Glad a lot of people are showing support, though.

 

I have to disagree with the sympathy for Zoe, given what people have caught her out lying about and saying (in-fact even one of the people who supported her for a while came to a realization and explained the difference between blindly defending her and doing it just because she claims to be the victim.) as well as the fact that if you say one thing against her you'll not only have a series of blind-sighted hooligans knocking obnoxiously against your email inbox, but you'll also be proclaimed as sexist/misogynistic.

 

Zoe has also been reported to be manipulating the matter to make herself look the victim. Lets also not forget she has supposedly attacked two charities and has certainly been the reason a event designed to "help women get into the games industry" was attacked and almost shut down, something she herself has also been making but with no date, start-year or anything and continues to accept donations for. Another thing I think is worth mentioning: She's anti-Trans.

 

Not to mention she also had a little run-in with Totalbiscuit if I'm not mistaken which resulted in quite a back-lash against him from the indiedevs he's worked with.

 

I in no way support the act of harassing her and others on any grounds, but I certainly don't think she should be getting away with  attacking charities*, almost shutting down events for her own gain and manipulating masses of people.

I understand my opinion is most likely an unpopular one and certainly not something people want to hear but it's there..

 

This article is also worth a read.

 

*She has attacked one, but has been linked two the attack on two others.

 

EDIT: I'm going to work around and try to gather up some of the sceenshots I was shown that pointed out the hypocritical and manipulative nature of the matter, just to make it a little more understandable from my perspective.

[CaptainBinky]

I think this discusses/explains brilliantly: http://dangolding.tumblr.com/post/95985875943/the-end-of-gamers

 

I'll be honest, this article kind of pisses me off a little. The only reason there is a perception problem with the word "gamer" is because every single time a psychopath does something horrible, or a few people act in a horrible way, everyone reports "Gamers do X" instead of "Arseholes do X". So while the parts of the article which sticks up for diversity of people who game and diversity of people who develop are good, 99.999999999999% of people who identify as "Gamers" feel the same. If people would only acknowledge this rather than demonise an entire group based on the actions of a fraction of arseholes we'd never have reached this point in the first place.

 

To put it in an analogy just for you, Will, how do you feel about football fans being criticized en masse for the actions of hooligans, and how would you feel if this distinction was never made clear in media?

 

Yes, there are *always* going be those who say, "you're not a gamer if you play x" but then I'd imagine there are those who'd say you're not a real football fan if you never go to live games... or only watch the national games. Big deal. If you call yourself a football fan, you're a football fan. If gaming is important enough to you that you'd identify yourself as a gamer, you're a gamer.

 

This:

[EnigmaGrey]

To put it in an analogy just for you, Will, how do you feel about football fans being criticized en masse for the actions of hooligans, and how would you feel if this distinction was never made clear in media?

My god, Will is a football fan? I'll never look at him the same again . . . having lived within a hundred meters of Ivor Wynne Stadium in Hamilton.

No, Will. You cannot park your fleet of cars on my lawn (back or front!), or drink beer on my deck. Go away, Will!

Spoiler

Frankly, I don't know how how to process the whole Zoe Quinn situation. It just looks like a keystone to releasing a whole bunch of rage in every direction. It makes it hard to determine not just what the argument is but whether there's even any truth or fact being employed by opponents.

Oh, wait. You mean soccer.

[Kirrus]

OK, this is going to be point by point, because tbh, the way she's been treated pisses me off no end, and Kitt, your viewpoint is exactly one of the most dangerous, and what the dicks are after.
 

I have to disagree with the sympathy for Zoe, given what people have caught her out lying about and saying (in-fact even one of the people who supported her for a while came to a realization and explained the difference between blindly defending her and doing it just because she claims to be the victim.) as well as the fact that if you say one thing against her you'll not only have a series of blind-sighted hooligans knocking obnoxiously against your email inbox, but you'll also be proclaimed as sexist/misogynistic.

In the url, It states; "Her being harassed does not negate what she did"

I assume this is about the young capitalists gamejam. They basically apologised earlier, weakly, for falsely accusing her of harming them, when in fact it's been proven to be 4chan.

 

There's more points, but to be honest, I stopped negating them one by one after that big one, because I'm tired of reading this shit. If you want, I'll go over the post point-by-point.
 

Zoe has also been reported to be manipulating the matter to make herself look the victim. Lets also not forget she has supposedly attacked two charities and has certainly been the reason a event designed to "help women get into the games industry" was attacked and almost shut down, something she herself has also been making but with no date, start-year or anything and continues to accept donations for. 

<Reliable citation needed.> Screenshots filled with red-ink are not trustable, and will be discounted out of hand. Considering the unending torrent of abuse she's been suffering, you're going to have to do a lot better. Again, see my comment above, the young capitalists, the charity she was supposedly attacking have come out and said "oops my bad".
 

Another thing I think is worth mentioning: She's anti-Trans.x

<Reliable citation needed. Contradicts second-hand character references.>
 

Not to mention she also had a little run-in with Totalbiscuit if I'm not mistaken which resulted in quite a back-lash against him from the indiedevs he's worked with.

You may not remember this, but The Indie Stone had a run in with Totalbiscuit. Personal opinion: He's a dick. Also, his personal life is currently pretty hellish, he only stepped in because he was getting so many people shouting at him to, which is not exactly the best time to have a reasoned argument or discussion.
 

I in no way support the act of harassing her and others on any grounds, but I certainly don't think she should be getting away with  attacking charities*, almost shutting down events for her own gain and manipulating masses of people.
I understand my opinion is most likely an unpopular one and certainly not something people want to hear but it's there..

Slander, misinformation, and lies. Again, contradicts second hand character reference, and already "attacking charities" has been proven to have been a ploy by the attackers to make things worse for her.
 

This article is also worth a read.

Doesn't negate in the slightest the problem of the attack she's currently under, and if someone tried to justify doing the same to any other person on the internet, male, female, or somewhere inbetween, I'd be as pissed of anyway.
 

*She has attacked one, but has been linked two the attack on two others.

<reliable citation needed.>
 

EDIT: I'm going to work around and try to gather up some of the sceenshots I was shown that pointed out the hypocritical and manipulative nature of the matter, just to make it a little more understandable from my perspective.

 

Fair warning, if you post any image from 4chan, or any image covered with red-scrawlings, I'll take it down. Find a reliable, relatively unbiased source. With full context.

 

It doesn't matter what she's done. It doesn't matter who she's screwed. It's her personal life, and it's NONE OF YOUR BUISINESS.

There is no evidence of 'sexual favours for reviews'. Hell, I'm biased, I keep RockPaperShotgun.com online in my day job, and guess who they hired during the period in question? Oh, Nathan Grayson. But, protip, search the RPS archive for stuff on Depression Quest. You'll find nothing of note by Nathan Grayson. Shock, horror. You've been bluffed dude, and you've not taken the time to go look into this for yourself.

Some things to read/watch;
http://t.co/CrBod2jfUq
http://botherer.org/2014/08/20/how-internet-hate-mobs-work-and-why-its-so-insidious/
http://badassdigest.com/2014/08/26/video-games-misogyny-and-terrorism-a-guide-to-assholes/


This. Is. Not. Acceptable. This is *NEVER* acceptable. We cannot seriously even think about trying to take an unbiased look at Zoe Quinn thanks to the massive splurt of hate and vitrol that her ex posted, and that our wonderful internet community blew up.

Do you even know how many women are in tech? Because I do. At my level, there are about maybe 0.5% in my field of expertise. That is bloody atrocious, and crap like this doesn't help.

[Kitt Frostpaws]

-Snip-

 

I'll admit all of my information is second-hand/based on what I've been told of the situation with a small amount of research, so yes it isn't a very good argument, in-fact I'm willing to as far as to say the information I've been given was heavily one-sided (This assumption coming from the fact the people I've been discussing the matter with are rather.. Different in the way they perceive this kind of thing, going as far as to bicker constantly about whether or not Depression Quest verifies as a game.)

 

As for the Young Capitalists Game Jam, I'll take a look into it - I haven't heard anything about them saying that.

 

You're right, stuff like this doesn't help - infact I'd go as-far as to say this is more of a deterrent in some manner of speaking, for the statistic I can't really say much other than in my entire time on my course(s) I've only known 3 women to be on the course and they were just studying tech subject because they failed it in high-school and/or needed it for a career-related issue.

 

I hadn't heard about the TIS run-in with TB, I'm just barely aware that something had happened but I've never actually heard the details, as for him being an ass I can see that quite clearly, those magical little numbers on youtube can do wonders to a persons ego I imagine it'd do even more-so to ones personality too.

 

 

Over-all Kirrus, that's quite the spectacular response and I do believe you've proved me wrong + incorrectly informed, or "bluffed" as you said, as well as given me some lovely responses+things to note about the subject matter next time the people in question start blathering on about it.

 

 

 

On a much brighter note:

This little shit here got 25 years for swatting. Thank god.

[nasKo]

On a much brighter note:

This little shit here got 25 years for swatting. Thank god.

Sorry to say but that's fake, too. Even the picture is taken from a different, unrelated case from January:

http://wivb.com/2014/01/10/teen-cries-out-during-sentencing/

The site the article is posted on is a satirical news site, just like The Onion.

(http://nationalreport.net/15-year-old-swatted-domestic-terrorism/)

Fell for it, too. For a minute. Until I actually saw the site itself.

[Keepbro]

One thing I've noticed is that TotalBiscuit seems to be in the background of all these things. Is he a shit stirrer? I don't follow him so I can't make an informed decision.

 

Also finally one more thing - even if this chick had been using her God given talents and assets to help her career along by shagging some twat reviewer (which I'm not saying that she has) then:

 

a) Whats the big fucking deal? I have worked in the Entertainment business and can give you many stories but I know of one guy who willingly slept with another man just to get his show on air and this guy was not a homosexual. I know of a band that willingly participated in an orgy for a record publisher AS SLAVES just so they could get a record deal (and they were dropped very soon after). So someone paid for good reviews with a hairy check. STOP THE PRESSES! CALL THE POLICE! INFORM THE ARCH-BISHOP!

 

b) Why is it our business? Is the internet now being judge and jury now? If so then I'd like to propose several million more deserving targets for internet justice than some fairly low key indie developer. Personally I think people's private life should be private and not disseminated on twitter.

[Kitt Frostpaws]

 

On a much brighter note:

This little shit here got 25 years for swatting. Thank god.

Sorry to say but that's fake, too. Even the picture is taken from a different, unrelated case from January:

http://wivb.com/2014/01/10/teen-cries-out-during-sentencing/

The site the article is posted on is a satirical news site, just like The Onion.

(http://nationalreport.net/15-year-old-swatted-domestic-terrorism/)

Fell for it, too. For a minute. Until I actually saw the site itself.

 

 

Yeah I'll admit I was a bit curious as to why an article was on Tumblr myself..

 

EDIT:

didn't mean for that to happen.

[Xydonus]

I think the whole TB thing concerning Indiestone is related to this -

- That probably created some bad blood...

 

In regards to the whole internet+privacy thing, I haven't really got a notion what's going on regards to that Zoe thing. I think it goes without saying that regardless of what you do (unless your a dirty trolling scumbag, then I have no sympathy) everyone is entitled to their privacy. Anyone who invades that privacy should be pursued using any legal means at your disposal, if possible, or otherwise, ignore the little shits, even though that's not always an easy choice.

[EnigmaGrey]

On the plus, if there was any bad blood, perhaps this indicates it's fading.

And, from 2012 on the old forums:

 

PZ isn't going to be finished for a very long time no doubt and there's little question that I'll cover it prior to version 1.0, if it ever gets there. The devs know how to get in touch if they want to do anything with me, if they don't I'll get to it in due time. As for the game, I've owned a copy for longer than most of you lot