Its been a while since I've played, can someone bring me up to date?

[ColonelJayce]

I've been playing for roughly 12 hours, and set up a terribly skimpy base for defense out in the woods, and I haven't been attacked by any hordes of zombies as of yet. Do zombies just not roam around in hordes? I see them do it on roads, but not in the forest. I would like to have 200 zombies come in from all sides and destroy my stuff, it would add to the atmosphere.

[mascou]

As of today not quite.

As soon as you clear a decent-size area you may remain safe inside it for years literally.

 

They implemented "zombie respawn" but it checks which tiles you have contraptions in and obviously the one you've been in before respawning so even if you'd set the setting to "daily respawn" you could stay safe for years too.

 

But on the other hand migration zombies that aren't "loaded" is i believe a feature likely to come in future patch as a step towards making the game less of a "Farmville" application in the later stages of the game

 

Wait and see

[ColonelJayce]

Well that is slightly disappointing, I had hoped that building fortifications would aid me in my survival against the horde. If I'm just going to be attacked by 1 - 2 zombies off the road here and there, I don't see any reason to build things.

[Jela331]

Well that is slightly disappointing, I had hoped that building fortifications would aid me in my survival against the horde. If I'm just going to be attacked by 1 - 2 zombies off the road here and there, I don't see any reason to build things.

 

In some future updates, the game will work against you. Meaning, you'll never be safe.

[Ohbal]

Well that is slightly disappointing, I had hoped that building fortifications would aid me in my survival against the horde. If I'm just going to be attacked by 1 - 2 zombies off the road here and there, I don't see any reason to build things.

 

That's one of the hottest topics at the moment. Indeed for some of us the game loses some challenge once you realize you can sit safely watching your crops grow, and nothing will ever come in your way. 

 

I really enjoy building things, but ultimately I'm building my safe houses to fulfill a purpose: keeping me safe. At the moment I just build becase I like to design crappy wood homes

[Sadeyx]

I think, be default, the zombie-focus is 'Urban focused' so, in general forested area's are very quiet and, as you say, rather boring

 

Even if you setup base somewhere urban and clear the area out, they dont nessesarily come to attack you specifically, they may wander by but thats just chanced based.  In anycase, walls and doors are extremly strong anyway.

[Jack Bower]

Shoot your gun in your base.

[Wolfen]

There was no hope of survival

This is how you farmed

 

:3

 

Love you, Zomboid devs

Loved the mondoid and have high hopes for you guys

 

;p

[Sadeyx]

 

This is how you farmed

wahahaha!

 

En One, En One.

[Sabrewulf]

Some day it will become a unique horde, and you will be fully destroyed.
Survive a zombie apocalypse only with zombies enemies isn't very hard,  i expect logical challenges, game with illogical difficulty levels are already many.

[Marco1]

This is how you farmed

 

Just great!

[Akai]

I am really curious how this horde migration will work and feel for us as players.

 

Before I stumbled upon PZ this fall, I played some 7 Days 2 Die. If you are not familiar with the game, let me explain one of the core ideas behind it real quick: The game doesn`t want you to be safe. Ever. So what happens is, that a horde comes visiting you. (Sounds familiar?) But HOW this was implemented is what really scared me away from the game. The hordes would come very regularly. Basically some time between 16:00 and 17:00 hours.. I could almost set my watch after those guys. And of course this horde would always aim with amazing accuracy at you. Doesn`t matter where you are, there WILL be a horde EXACTLY in your face. Third big point is what those zombies did to actually make sure, that they would be a "threat": They would rip down EVERYTHING in their path. I have seen Zombies demolishing massive stone houses and digging straight through hills to get to my fort. Ridiculous, really. So what did I do? Since any kind of structure would be torn down once a day and either rebuilding or setting up death traps would be really high maintenance I decided to go another way. I experimented with some designs and came up with a House built on pillars. I basically moved my whole setup into the first story, including vegetable garden. The Zombies would come and flood mostly around the pillars while I was cowering in my little house above their heads and watch them pass by through a trap door. When the horde passed I would come down and finish off the one or two stragglers nibbling on my pillars (sounds kinda wrong). At that moment I basically won the game by breaking this core mechanic.

 

Well my point is: The whole experience of the game felt absolutely artificial. It was just too obvious that the game was trying to kick me in the nuts, just because the devs wanted to desperately occupy the player. This ruined the whole game for me... others may not feel so strong about this fact but I felt absolutely insulted by such an unrealistic zombie-behaviour. Seriously... digging straight through hills...

Almost needless to say, that I do not want to see something similar in the future of PZ. If I sit walled off in my Fort of Impenetration and a horde strolls along, neither smelling nor hearing nor seeing anything of interest to them I simply don`t want them to rip down my log walls just because the game thinks it needs to keep me on my toes. Realistic (as far as we can tell ) Zombie behaviour is one of the big strenghts of PZ and regular, almost organised and intelligent attacks on a player base would be simply contradictory to that.

Let alone the fact that most people struggle sometimes with opening a bag of chips but as undead they suddenly tear down massive walls and crack open rib cages.

 

I am curious, what do the rest of you think about those possible base attacks? How should they work? Specific attacks or random encounters of huge hordes migrating in the ever more desperate search for food?

[Marco1]

[post deleted]

[Moose65]

 

I am curious, what do the rest of you think about those possible base attacks? How should they work? Specific attacks or random encounters of huge hordes migrating in the ever more desperate search for food?

 

If done right, I still think NPCs will be the end-game solution to boredom. Sure, zombies won't naturally attack your base (especially if your being quite, have no lights on, and have vision blocked off) but think about it. A foolish NPC running from a horde, stumbles upon your fortification. Even if they don't try to get inside it, they've brought a horde to you, and now its attention may be turned to your fortification.

 

Then there is the possibility of bandit packs, groups of roaming NPCs looking for EXACTLY what the zombies may be ignoring, a recently built structure that indicates someone living in the area. They'll naturally try to get inside and loot everything, or even kill you if you happen to be home at the time.

 

There's lots of late game threats that can be added, but sadly I don't think zombies will ever get more dangerous, simply because their behavior is exploitable. NPCs leading hordes to your base, bandits, feral dog packs, and even bears are gonna more likely be more of a threat then a horde of zombies attacking your base by themselves.

[Sadeyx]

I dont know.. building a base should attract attention, I think 7days has got that part right at least, the only issue is how predictable they are and how easy it is just to surround your base with spikes.

 

If PZ were to do something similar I would hope for something a bit more organic and maybe something more related to smell.  Zombies right now have vision and hearing but I dont think there is a smell mechanic yet.

 

They should be able to smell cooking food, animals caught in traps,  smoke from a burning camp fire maybe even the smell of certain growing fruits and veg.

[Moose65]

They should be able to smell cooking food, animals caught in traps,  smoke from a burning camp fire maybe even the smell of certain growing fruits and veg.

 

 

Pretty sure most zombie lore don't have zombies who can sniff out fruits and veggies.......now the light from a campfire might attract them, but general zombie lore doesn't have zombies with a super sense of smell.

 

Not sure if its working, but animals caught in traps are already "suppose" to attract zombies (noise + live bait). My guess is its probably not working because 1) You cant catch animals to begin with if zombies are nearby and 2) I've yet to see my traps ever attract any zombies.

 

But yeah, I don't see why zombies would be interested in fruits, veggies, or cooked meat. Now, freshly spilled blood on the other hand..........that I could defiantly see. But yeah, zombies probably won't ever be bloodhounds by default.

 

Now if you want to discuss NPCs smelling out some fresh growing fruits and veggies, that would be an entirely different manner

 

Edit: Zombies do have a smell setting. Its normal by default, and if I have to guess, its probably the radius they can detect you without hearing or line of sight. I'm gonna guess its probably ridiculously small (which would be appropriate for a normal person) and if you set it to bloodhound then they'll probably be able to pick you up from quite a distance.

 

Edit Edit: Smell appears to do almost nothing at all. Set zombies to bloodhound with poor vision/hearing, and I could still easily sneak up on them. After killing about a dozen with my bare hands, I went and started punching out windows till I was severely bleeding. It seemed to make a very "minor" difference, as in if I snuck up to about 2 tiles away from them they would turn around.......so practically none at all.

[Ohbal]

what do the rest of you think about those possible base attacks? How should they work? Specific attacks or random encounters of huge hordes migrating in the ever more desperate search for food?

 

I still have a strong feeling that in the end some scripting may be necessary. 

 

But ideally, it whould be an organic system. What you do should affect the visibility of your camp. If I've spent three hours chopping trees, I would expect to draw some attention to my area. If I'm shooting near my safe-house, or making a campfire, or barricading, or... you get the point. Also, something that has been mentioned a gazillion times, is the "follow the leader" effect that is mentioned in WWZ and TWD for example: it would be great if zombies would keep on going and following other moving zombies, creating a chain effect that could "lead them" to your base.

[Sadeyx]

 

They should be able to smell cooking food, animals caught in traps,  smoke from a burning camp fire maybe even the smell of certain growing fruits and veg.

 

 

Pretty sure most zombie lore don't have zombies who can sniff out fruits and veggies.......now the light from a campfire might attract them, but general zombie lore doesn't have zombies with a super sense of smell.

 

Yea, it is a stretch to say that they could smell growing veg! lol

 

However, in my mind, Zombies with a great sense of vision is far more inplausable than a strong sense of smell.  Hunger is usually what drives a zombie and since they are normally blind they depend on smell and sound.  Especially the smell of blood.

 

In anycase, what specific 'lore' zombies follow doesnt matter, in PZ those settings are all adjustable,  for gameplay reasons there needs to be something which moves zombies from a greater distance in your general direction.  Random sounds are soon forgotton, and seeing movement is just fleeting, but a strong smell that wafts over constantly from a campfire cooking rabbit stew.. a bit more plausable in my mind

[Akai]

 

Also, something that has been mentioned a gazillion times, is the "follow the leader" effect that is mentioned in WWZ and TWD for example: it would be great if zombies would keep on going and following other moving zombies, creating a chain effect that could "lead them" to your base.

 

 

I agree, this would be a nice way of doing things and make them feel organic whis is paramount in my opinion. I don`t actually care if it is scripted as long as it feels plausible. The zerg is strong in the zombies!

[Moose65]

In anycase, what specific 'lore' zombies follow doesnt matter

 

It kinda does though, as the developers have stated before that they want to follow the romero/War Z(book, not the awful movie) lore, so your not gonna ever have zombies who either smell that well or are attracted to said smells in the game by default any time soon. There's more believable ways for a horde to be drawn to your base, but that won't be one of them. Zombies are not interested in cook meat anyways, a fresh kill maybe, but anything that has been dead for much longer isn't gonna interest them. Zombies are not smart enough to make the association with cooked meat smell and a live person behind it, let alone having the capability to smell that out from very far away.

 

You always have the option to jack up zombies in sandbox though.

[Sadeyx]

 

In anycase, what specific 'lore' zombies follow doesnt matter

 

 Zombies are not interested in cook meat anyways,

I think you mis-understand.

 

Its not about them being attracted to cooking smells because it makes them hungry, anymore than the sound of an alarm indicates food.

 

When they detect noise they arnt able to differentiate if that noise is coming from, a source of food, or if its just rain, or an alarm or a gunshot,  they just head towards it all the same because it just provides a direction.  presumably in hopes that it indicates human activity..  and nothing in the world indicates human activity more than the smell of cooking food lol

 

Since you cant 'smell' blood in real life, yet zombies can.. seems to me they have perfect smell sense.

 

But as I said, the lore doesnt matter,  the Devs have already made it so that Zombies are attracted to themselves! there is no zombie "lore" where zombies attract themselves,  its just an added 'attraction mechanic' for gameplay reasons to make it so that they bunch up organically.

 

You could say that Indie Stone are developing their own zombie lore,  no reason why smell cant be added as an attraction mechanic to overcome the problem of walls and defences being entirley pointless.

 

Im not arguing that this should be the mechanic they use, but something needs to be done, and this is one possability that I can think of.

[Moose65]

Its not about them being attracted to cooking smells because it makes them hungry, anymore than the sound of an alarm indicates food.

In most zombie lore, they pretty much ignore cooked food. Again, their not smart enough to put 2 + 2 together to get 4.

 

Since you cant 'smell' blood in real life, yet zombies can.. seems to me they have perfect smell sense.

 

Sorry, but your completely wrong on this one here. If you've ever bled from more than a tiny scratch, you will defiantly smell an "iron" type of smell.

 

But as I said, the lore doesnt matter,  the Devs have already made it so that Zombies are attracted to themselves! there is no zombie "lore" where zombies attract themselves,  its just an added 'attraction mechanic' for gameplay reasons to make it so that they bunch up organically.

 

This is more than likely them using the wrong term, where they simply state the gameplay mechanic. Zombies do tend to group up in lore, and they are attracted to each others actions. If one of them moans and starts heading in a direction, they typically all tend to do that. Especially in TWD, if one starts walking in a direction or starts banging on a door, the others will do the same.

 

Its like when they accidentally used the word spawn instead of migrate, and it caused people to flip out. Same scenario here, its just them simply trying to get zombies to work as a group, speaking of the "literal" mechanic, but in essence its the same thing as the lore. When one zombie moves and moans, the others tend to follow suit in the same direction.

 

You could say that Indie Stone are developing their own zombie lore,  no reason why smell cant be added as an attraction mechanic to overcome the problem of walls and defences being entirley pointless.

 

They could be, but again they stated they wanted to stay true to the romero lore as much as possible. It simply doesn't make sense for that type of smell to attract them, especially since humans don't have a super sense of smell to start with. Again, their not that smart, they have only the most basic instincts, and they have no interest in anything that isn't alive or very recently slain.

 

Like I said, there is sandbox to jack up that option if you want to, and I'm sure they'll have more realistic ways to bring a horde knocking on your door that follows the classic zombie lore.

 

I understand you want a challenging game, we all do. BUT, a lot of us want realism and classic zombie lore as well.

[Akai]

 

They could be, but again they stated they wanted to stay true to the romero lore as much as possible. It simply doesn't make sense for that type of smell to attract them, especially since humans don't have a super sense of smell to start with. Again, their not that smart, they have only the most basic instincts, and they have no interest in anything that isn't alive or very recently slain.

 

Just out of curiosity since you seem to be into zombie lore: How do they determine that something is alive in the first place? Is it simply the abscence of the strong decay scent?

Edited February 3, 2015 by Akai

[Ohbal]

I'm basing this post on Max Brooks and Romero's lore.

 

The "how" is not really specified though, hopefully someone with deeper knowlege will be able to answer.  

 

Romero's:

 

 

Throughout the Romero films, all zombies are hazardous to human life. Their only instinct is to feed relentlessly on living organisms - they do not feed to satisfy hunger, and even specimens who have been completely disemboweled will still desire to feed, as long as brain function is present.

 

Source: http://zombie.wikia.com/wiki/Romero_zombies

 

WWZ's:

 

Smell:

 

Unlike with sound, the undead have a more acute sense of smell. In both combat situations and laboratory tests, they have been able to distinguish the smell of living prey above all others. In many cases, and given ideal wind conditions, zombies have been known to smell fresh corpses from a distance of more than a mile[...]

It is not known exactly what particular secretion signals the presence of prey: sweat, pheromones, blood, etc. In the past, people attempted to mask their human scent with perfumes, deodorants, or other strong smelling chemicals. None were successful. 

 

Source: The Zombie Survival Guide by Max Brooks

[Moose65]

WWZ's:

 

Smell:

 

Unlike with sound, the undead have a more acute sense of smell. In both combat situations and laboratory tests, they have been able to distinguish the smell of living prey above all others. In many cases, and given ideal wind conditions, zombies have been known to smell fresh corpses from a distance of more than a mile[...]

It is not known exactly what particular secretion signals the presence of prey: sweat, pheromones, blood, etc. In the past, people attempted to mask their human scent with perfumes, deodorants, or other strong smelling chemicals. None were successful. 

 

Source: The Zombie Survival Guide by Max Brooks

 

Been awhile since I've read that book and I had forgotten that part. That's probably the main reason that they keep saying no to zombie camo like what they do on TWD.