Consequences to killing people.

[Elizabeth Bailey]

I think it would be cool if, as the number of survivors you killed goes up, the appropriate moodle that pops up would get worse and pops up maybe at random given times, and more frequent the more people you kill, something like once youve killed a couple of people your character can go crazy and get depressed, and if you continue, you will eventually go insane and severly depressed at random given times? I geuss this would tie in with a sanity system, and it will only get worse and more frequent. which would deffidently change the way you interact with NPC's. But maybe the Moodle could affect vision and/or hearing, or some other consequence(s), so that it could work for multiplayer too..I Hope something like this will be a thing, to make killing not just a normal thing for your character to live with, and not being able to just kill all the NPC's or other players online without consequence in your character.

 

I have realized after posting this that this has already been talked about. sorry.

Edited December 19, 2014 by Elizabeth Bailey

[Ewok]

Don't be sorry, it's still a good idea.

 

However, I think it should work in reverse...

 

The first few kills should hit you harder than the later ones (should you choose to go down that route), but there should always be some consequence.

 

First few kills - extreme depression, feeling nauseated etc

 

After that - a bit of depression

 

Maybe your character can also develop a negative trait that makes interacting with NPCs more difficult as well. If you are the kind of person who kills without remorse, then you are probably not going to be the most social/empathic of people.

[MadDan]

After playing This War of Mine and seeing how the characters react to the things you do... I definitely felt that it should be handled as depressingly as it is in TWoM. Stealing & Killing should hit you hard. Depending on who you are I guess, I don't want to lose control like in TWoM, even though I don't find it annoying I just don't think it suits PZ.

 

Say you kill a person, you should get really depressed. When you get the time to actually think on what you did, like back at your base, and then start regretting your decisions with the text overhead. Then need to talk to someone to help you feel somewhat better and have the same type of dialogue overhead. Becoming broken could be fine, but have it almost impossible at that point to befriend and NPC, and be seen as a threat to any other NPCs instead of them killing themselves.

 

It's up the devs at the end of that day, but I definitely hope it's not "Here, take some Anti-Depressants  -- No more depression." It would be nice and very fitting for PZ to have a much deeper feeling of sadness and hurt from their actions when NPCs are introduced, yet still if you were on your own too. In TWoM those little dialogue pieces overhead that say "Stealing from people?! Is that how low we've become?" "Yesterday he/she was with us and now..." Makes me seriously feel bad about what I did, and of how risky I became. It honestly fits PZ more than I could imagine.

[Jack Bower]

The consequence is I have to pick up more weight.

[MadDan]

I felt happy in TWoM when I bashed in two elders' heads and stole their stuff. Don't ask.

But it was at the base that felt like the game was saying "Think about what you've done". The dialogue made me feel rrally bad on top of it. I want to feel like I had a reason to kill in PZ, cause otherwise it'll just be me killing people if there are no serious consequences to my character, or my group.

[Troblin]

I'm sorry but have to state this talk as idiotic. No disrespect, just statement - every country has thousands of criminals, violent ones too. Guess what, they don't need music, comfort and bj because their fragile inner world is depressed. They need all that cuz they crossed the line and now want to get more fruit for their choice, period.

 

We could talk of personality traits during character generation that lead to depression from killing people, or even zombies, and they'd be giving some + points. Maybe there could be discomfort from first few kills - the learning curve, like for students vomiting during first autopsies, but....

 

"Don't try to tell me that you couldn't kill a man

That's a load of fucking bullshit,boy,I know you can!!!" © Clawfinger ©

Not lovely. Be lovely. You can make your point without calling people idiotic for their opinions.

[King jjwpenguin]

I think that it should depend on how long you survive and how ruthless you are like if there is a new trait ruthless or a prisoner job class. If you kill a lot at the beginning you feel worse but after time you get over it or after you see more happen like zombies. The new trait or job idea would make it so the time which it takes to get over it is little to none. that or make it go away faster or occur less often. It all depends on how long you survive or your moral. Just my thoughts.

[MadDan]

^ You shall not be insulted for your thoughts, Mr Penguin.

 

No one besides someone who's actually killed will know what it feels like after killing someone. We're supposed to be ordinary people, not murderers. If you killed someone in self-defense, maybe you wouldn't immediately fall to the floor crying, however, if their wife, or girlfriend or whoever came to their side as they lay dying, and started crying calling you a monster for killing their beloved when they were only trying to survive, you would feel bad.

 

I keep bringing up TWoM, but in the lategame for that, my one job was to get meds (dynamic, I failed) at all costs. I killed numerous people in self defense and not, just to get a bottle of pills a day. It's when the world gets in to chaos that everything goes to crap and going outside means you're stepping into the unknown, where killing is almost your only option. Having a group at that point would be a great help because the rest just end up not giving a crap because the world is not going to be the same again.

 

Or we could do it almost the simplest way: Your character is YOU, you play how you want to, not how the game wants you to, and the NPCs can feel the effects in a random manner. I just want to be able to console my friends in the game if they are depressed and have the dialogue that makes me feel connected to them.

 

I guess the major difference between TWoM and PZ in this regard, is you play as one person in PZ, the others, are others and have different views and opinions. TWoM you play as the entire group and they are pretty much set as their own views of the world and the situation.

[Ontogenesis]

Well, the idiosyncratic meaning placed on killing someone else will determine their reaction to it. Maybe they'll see it as necessary? Self-defence? Survival? A huge mistake? An immoral act? I guess the meaning depends on a combination of the person's personality (e.g. a disposition to certain ways of thinking about situations), the context the killing, and the person's history... Could be an interesting system to create! I loved the dialogue and reactions in TWoM. Brought the characters to life.

[Tomwa]

How about we let the player choose to feel bad over theft and killing? I don't want you to be my moral judge. I am more than capable of feeling remorse and disappointment the devs should focus on building high quality NPCs with deep stories behind them.

Don't tell me how to feel.

[Crossbow7734]

I agree with you Tomwa game should serve us different persons ( not only characters) with their own story and when you killing someone you ( not your charcter) should think about this, you should feel wrong or right... because it was a person maybe you don't have to kill maybe now his group try to punish you or maybe they will starve because scravenger didn't come back.

P.S: I apologise for my english but it isn't my native language.

[EnigmaGrey]

How about we let the player choose to feel bad over theft and killing? I don't want you to be my moral judge. I am more than capable of feeling remorse and disappointment the devs should focus on building high quality NPCs with deep stories behind them.

Don't tell me how to feel.

I'd rather the character were it's own moral judge, instead of the player. At least then it makes some sense . . . as it did in TWoM, even if it felt a bit limited there.

Should be both components, in other words. Player's personal feelings and the character they're currently playing with.

[Tomwa]

I'm not a fan of TWoM, I didn't like having characters I played as act out emotions I didn't feel. I didn't have a problem attacking certain kinds of people especially those who attacked me first so I don't think my character should mope around about it because I made them survive. It just seems like a stupid mechanic for forcing the player to behave. I shouldn't be forced to question my motives because "Oh what if my characters sits around crying or tries to drink bleach", I should be questioning ACTUAL REASONS LIKE: "What will his friends do? Will they come looking for me? What about my allies? Will they turn on me? Could he have joined us? Would it have been better that way?"

But I mean if you want a shallow moodle based depression system based on "You killed people cuz you needed food now feel sad" that works too.

[EnigmaGrey]

I'm not a fan of TWoM, I didn't like having characters I played as act out emotions I didn't feel. I didn't have a problem attacking certain kinds of people especially those who attacked me first so I don't think my character should mope around about it because I made them survive. It just seems like a stupid mechanic for forcing the player to behave. I shouldn't be forced to question my motives because "Oh what if my characters sits around crying or tries to drink bleach", I should be questioning ACTUAL REASONS LIKE: "What will his friends do? Will they come looking for me? What about my allies? Will they turn on me? Could he have joined us? Would it have been better that way?"

But I mean if you want a shallow moodle based depression system based on "You killed people cuz you needed food now feel sad" that works too.

Eh, I see it as little different from panic. You may not be terrified of the zombies, but your character is.

Why limit your character to a Gorden Freeman of emotion?

[IronCoffins]

Even John Rambo said it, "once you start killin, it's as easy as breathing" so their you go. I think the first few times you do kill another player, whether npc or human alike, your character should be depressed about it in various ways. But the longer you go on the more your player changes getting used to the horrors of this new life. Hell maybe even have a random chance of being a psycho or "bad guy" And that

Could work by simply killing in offense, instead of defense. Defensive kills could keep your player "on the path" kinda like a karma system I suppose.

[Jack Bower]

I gun down people and don't feel bad at all.

[IronCoffins]

That's becuse you have a unique set of traits

[Ewok]

Even John Rambo said it, "once you start killin, it's as easy as breathing" so their you go. I think the first few times you do kill another player, whether npc or human alike, your character should be depressed about it in various ways. But the longer you go on the more your player changes getting used to the horrors of this new life. Hell maybe even have a random chance of being a psycho or "bad guy" And that

Could work by simply killing in offense, instead of defense. Defensive kills could keep your player "on the path" kinda like a karma system I suppose.

While I totally agree with the priciple of diminishing emotional effects as time goes on and your avatar becomes acclimatised to killing, I do feel the need to point out that John Rambo is fictional...

[IronCoffins]

 

Even John Rambo said it, "once you start killin, it's as easy as breathing" so their you go. I think the first few times you do kill another player, whether npc or human alike, your character should be depressed about it in various ways. But the longer you go on the more your player changes getting used to the horrors of this new life. Hell maybe even have a random chance of being a psycho or "bad guy" And that

Could work by simply killing in offense, instead of defense. Defensive kills could keep your player "on the path" kinda like a karma system I suppose.

While I totally agree with the priciple of diminishing emotional effects as time goes on and your avatar becomes acclimatised to killing, I do feel the need to point out that John Rambo is fictional...

 

ok then well if you want to play that game then, how about,  Richard Kuklinski aka The Iceman. Killing not once bothered that guy.

[EnigmaGrey]

While I totally agree with the priciple of diminishing emotional effects as time goes on and your avatar becomes acclimatised to killing, I do feel the need to point out that John Rambo is fictional...

And that First Blood is a decent read.

/offtopic

[IronCoffins]

 

While I totally agree with the priciple of diminishing emotional effects as time goes on and your avatar becomes acclimatised to killing, I do feel the need to point out that John Rambo is fictional...

And that First Blood is a decent read.

/offtopic

 

yes.....yes it is....

[Wolfen]

I like the idea, given that certain occupations and or traits can get around it